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CASE
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COURT OF GENERAL SESSIONS OF THE PEACE, City and Country of New York,
Part II.
The People
Against
James Donnelly. Before
Hon. Frederick Smyth and a Jury. New York, February 26, 1894.
Indicted for Murder in the First Degree. Indictment filed July 13th, 1893. APPEARANCES.
Assistant District Attorneys John F. McIntyre and Randolph B. Martine, Jr., for the People; Messrs. House & Friend, for the Defense.
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PATRICK F. COLLINS, a witness called on behalf of the people, being duly sworn, testified as follows:
Mr. McIntyre: The People offer in evidence a diagram of the premises described in the indictment, and where the alleged homicide occurred; and it is consented by counsel for the defendant that the same be admitted.
Mr. House: For what it is worth. I don't mean to say that it is absolutely a correct diagram. The Court: Well, is it substantially correct? Is it conceded to be substantially correct?
Mr. House: Yes, sir; I presume it is; but I do not wish to concede that it is absolutely correct. However, we will let it go in for what it is worth.
Mr. McIntyre: Then I will have to send for Mr. Smyth and prove it. Examine the witness. Mr. House: No, we will concede it.
The Court: Then that diagram is offered in evidence, and is received, by consent, in evidence, with the understanding that the diagram is substantially correct?
Mr. House: Yes, sir.
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The Court: Then mark it People's Exhibit 1. DIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. Martine:
Q. Mr. Collins, where do you reside? By the Court:
Q. Where do you live, Collins? A. At the present time?
A. Yes.
A. Well, I've got no regular residence now, not at the present time. By Mr. Martine:
Q. Where was your last place of residence? A. 27th Street.
Q. What number? A. 207.
By the Court:
Q. East or West? A. West.
By Mr. Martine:
Q. Won't you speak a little louder? This last gentleman on the back seat has to hear everything you say. East or West?
A. On the West side. By the Court:
Q. 207 West 27th Street? A. Yes, sir.
By Mr. Martine:
Q. Did you know Charles Madden in his lifetime? A. I did, sir.
Q. Do you know the defendant, Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know the saloon on the northeast corner of 28th St.
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and 8th Avenue? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, coming down to the 28th day of May last, do you recall where you were that afternoon? A. I do, sir.
Q. Where were you?
A. I was in the house, until I went into that saloon. Q. What time did you go into that saloon?
A.
A quarter past three.
Q. Who was in there at the time?
A. At the time, there was Mr. McCabe, the other barkeeper, me and George Ruch and O'Keefe, and Madden come in.
By the Court:
Q. What was the name of the man who came in? A. Madden. He come in afterwards.
By Mr. Martine:
Q. What did you do while he was there?
A. He come in and stepped up to the bar, and he had a cigar in his hand. Q. Now, not so fast. Did Madden take a drink?
The Court: Well, let him go on and tell it.
Mr. House: Now, don't lead him. Let him tell what he did. By the Court:
Q. At what time did madden come in? You say you got in there at a quarter past three, as I understand you? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. About how long were you in the saloon?
A. I remained there until the time of the affray.
Q. Well, about how long had you been in the saloon before Madden came in?
A. Well, it was about five minutes *** four. I think when Madden came in; about that time. Q. Now the deceased was there at the time - the defendant, I mean?
A. Yes, sir, yes, your Honor.
Q. Now go on and tell the jury what you saw and what you heard in that saloon?
A. Madden steps to the cigar-lighter; he lights his cigar, and then he asked the defendant, Mr. James Donnelly, for a glass of beer. Mr. Donnelly says, "No. Get out of here, got out of here. God damn you, I have told you before to keep out of here," at that turning and deliberately drawing the revolver from the drawer.
Mr. House: Now, one moment. I object to that, "At that turning, and deliberately drawing the revolver from the drawer".
The Court: Yes, I will strike that out. I will strike out "deliberately". You cannot get this class of witnesses to testify, Mr. House, as a lawyer would. I will strike out "deliberately".
Mr. House: Certainly, sir. I know it is difficult to restrain these witnesses from characterize-
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By the Court:
Q. Now he asked for a glass of beer? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And the defendant said no? A. Yes, sir.
Q. This man said no?
A. Yes, sir, and then he says, "I will give you no beer." Q. Yes. And what about the swearing part of it?
A. He said, "Get out, get out, God damn you. I told you before to keep out of here." Q. Well, go on.
A. Then drawing the revolver --- By Mr. Martine:
Q. From where?
A. From the drawer.
Q. Where; what drawer? A. The second drawer.
Q. Can you indicate upon this diagram (People's Exhibit 1) where he took it from? (The diagram is shown to the witness). There is the bar, and there is the cigar-lighter---
The Court: Be kind enough to put a pencil mark there. By Mr. Martine:
Q. Yes, sir. This is the front of the bar here. There is the cigar-lighter. A. This is the bar?
Q. Yes.
A. And this is the drawer here, facing the 8th Avenue side, if this is 8th Avenue.
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Q. No; this is 8th Avenue, and this is 28th Street? A. Well, it is the second drawer.
By the Court:
Q. The second drawer? A. Yes, sir.
The Court: Please mark it.
Mr. Martine: Yes, sir. I will marked it A. The witness indicates the second drawer, market A, as the place where the revolver was taken from.
By the Court:
Q. You say he drew the revolver from the second drawer? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now go on?
A. Well, at that, he told Madden, "Get out of here." I made that remark before. Q. Never mind about that. Well, go on?
A. And he says, "I told you to keep out of here," and, with that, he turns, and draws the revolver and fires. Madden turns backwards and staggers out, saying, "I am shot".
By Mr. Martine:
Q. Where did he go out; out of the side door? A. Out the side entrance.
Q. What happened then?
A. Well, I went out after him. I seen him going out, and I went out. Before he went out, Officer O'Neill came in; and Officer O'Neill took my name and
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Took George Ruch's name, and O'Keefe's name, and he wanted to know who fired the shot.
Mr. House: I Object to that, to the latter part of that answer, "he happened to be on the outside, at the time, on 8th Avenue".
The Court: Yes; I will strike that out.
(The latter part of the answer is stricken out by order of the Court). By the Court:
Q. Now keep on. What did Officer O'Neill say?
A. He wanted to know who fired the shot. He first asked me and O'Keefe and ruch, and then Mr. Donnelly replied, "I fired the shot".
By Mr. Martine:
Q. Then what did he do?
A. Then Officer O'Keefe ---
Q. Officer O'Neill, you mean?
A. Yes, sir; Officer O'Neill then told Donnelly that he would have to go with him. Q. And where did he take him?
By the Court:
Q. Wait a moment. Let him go on. Then what happened, what was the next thing? By Mr. Martine:
Q. What followed then?
A. He went out, and Mr. Donnelly went out with him, and he seen Madden laying on the sidewalk.
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By the Court:
Q. Well, did you go out too? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What did the officer do with the defendant?
A. He asked Mr. Donnelly - Madden was laying on the sidewalk, and he asked him, "Who shot you?" and he said, "Mr. Donnelly, and that's him, and he shot me for nothing at all."
By Mr. Martine:
Q. Now, I want you to indicate where you were standing when the shot was fired, in the saloon (the diagram is shown to the witness).
The Court: Point out to him the 8th Avenue side.
Mr. Martine: This is the 8th Avenue side, and this is the 28th Street side (indicating). The Witness: I was standing this side of the cigar-lighter, reading the paper.
Q. Well, this is the bar (indicating)?
A. I was standing right here (indicating), that is, on the turn of the bar, on the 8th Avenue side; and here was Madden, just this side of the cigar-lighter (indicating).
Q. Well, this is the floor, right here. This would be on the bar?
A. Well, it isn't on the bar. Here is the cigar-lighter, and here is the bar, and there was Madden, and I
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stood over there, reading the newspaper. By the Court:
Q. Just at the turn, or a little beyond the turn? A. Yes, sir.
The Court: Now, mark that B. Mr. Martine: Yes, sir.
The Court: B is where Madden stood, he says, and C is where the witness stood. Show that to the jury now.
Mr. Martine: Yes, sir. Now the witness indicates B as where Madden was, standing facing the bar, and C is where he was standing.
By Mr. Martine:
Q. Now, Madden was within the range of your vision? By the Court:
Q. No. You could see Madden plainly, couldn't you?
A. Yes, sir; why certainly, I could see him plainly. He was within three feet of me. By Mr. Martine:
Q. How was he standing? By the Court:
Q. Show us his position. Stand up and show us.
A. He was standing that way (illustrating), leaning with his left arm
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on the bar.
By Mr. Martine:
Q. Did you notice where his right hand was? A. His right hand stood by his side.
Q. Did he have anything in it? A. I didn't see nothing in it.
Q. Did you see Madden make any attempt with his right hand towards his hip pocket? A. I did not.
Q. If he had made such an attempt, could you have seen it? Objected to.
The Court: No, that will do. You need not answer that question. By Mr. Martine:
Q. When you went outside, with Officer O'Neill and the defendant, where Madden was lying on the walk, did you remain there, after Donnelly was taken away?
A. I remained there until he was taken away in the ambulance. I mean Madden. Q. I mean Madden. To what hospital; do you know?
A. It was marked the Roosevelt Hospital. By the Court:
Q. You didn't go, did you? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you go with the ambulance? A. No, your Honor, I didn't
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Q. Now you saw an ambulance, did you? A. Yes, sir, I did.
Q. And you saw the man Madden put in the ambulance and taken away? A. Yes, sir.
By Mr. Martine:
Q. You did not go and see Madden at the hospital afterwards, did you? A. I did not.
By the Court:
Q. You said you saw the defendant take the pistol out of the second drawer? A. I did, your Honor.
Q. Did you see any flash or hear any report? A. I heard the report.
Q. You heard the report? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know what the defendant did with the pistol, after using it? A. He replaced it back in the drawer.
Q. When the officer came here, did the officer get the pistol? A. Yes, your Honor, he did.
Q. Well, what was said or done about that pistol, when the officer came? A. The officer asked who fired the shot.
Q. Yes, go on.
A. And Ruch and O'Keefe, he went to them first --- Q. Well, you told us that?
A. And they said they didn't do it, and Mr. Donnelly spoke out then and said, "I fired the shot".
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Q. Yes. Well, now, what about the revolver or pistol?
A. Well, Mr. O'Neill then said --- officer O'Neill said, "Well, I will have to take you. Where is the revolver?" and Mr. Donnelly took and opened the drawer and gave him the revolver.
The Foreman: Is it indicated on the diagram, your Honor, where Donnelly stood? The Court: What is that?
The Foreman: Is it indicated on the diagram, your Honor, where Donnelly stood, when he fired the shot? The Court: No, it is not, I think.
By the Court:
Q. Now where was Donnelly, the juror wants to know? Can you point out what part of the bar he was at? A. Well this is supposed to be the cigar-lighter here?
Q. Yes. Was he inside of the bar, to commence with? A. He was inside of it.
Q. He was inside of the bar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now can you point out whereabouts he was? A. Well, I should say about here (indicating).
Q. There, you say? A. Yes, sir.
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By Mr. Martine:
Q. About here? Make a mark.
A. It was about three feet from the cigar-lighter. The Court: Now he marks it D, Mr. Juror.
Just let the jury see it, where the defendant stood.
Mr. Martine: He marks D as the place where the defendant stood when he fired the shot, about three feet from the cigar lighter.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY Mr. House:
Q. Mr. Collins, do you recollect that, on the 21st day of June, 1893, you were a witness before the Coroner? A. I do.
Q. That was right on the opposite side of Chambers Street here, No. 32? A. I do.
Q. And do you recollect that the Coroner was William J. McKenna? A. I do.
Q. And you were examined there as a witness? Sa yes or no.
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And, before you were examined there as a witness, you were sworn to tell the truth? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Yes. And was your recollection of the facts as clear in your mind, in June, 1893, as it is now, regarding the circumstances of this shooting?
A. Do I remember it?
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Q. I ask you the question: Was your recollection regarding the facts and circumstances of the shooting as clear in your mind in June, 1893, as it is now?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now you are sure of that? A. Yes, sir.
Q. There can be no mistake regarding that? A. No, sir.
Q. The shooting occurred on Sunday afternoon, the 28th day of May of last year? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And, at that time, Mr. Collins, you were engaged in the ice business, were you not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. As a driver for a Mrs. Glascow? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And whereabouts were you living on the 28th day of May, 1893? A. Whereabouts was I living?
Q. Yes; at that time?
A. That was in 27th Street. Q. No. 207?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And how long had you been residing at No. 207? A. About four months; three or four months.
Q. Was your wife residing there with you at the time? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long had you been employed by Mrs. Glascow at that time? A. Going on over two years; two years and three months or so.
Q. About two years and three months? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you were the driver for an ice wagon for Mrs. Glascow?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you had been for some time serving ice at this saloon, at 28th Street and 8th Avenue? A. Yes, sir.
Q. This was the saloon at which the shooting occurred? A. Yes, sir.
Q, Now, Mr. Collins, can you recollect about how long you have been engaged in delivering ice at that saloon? A. I should say, about nine months.
Q. About nine months?
A. That is, I was second hand, first, with the other driver. Q. With the other driver?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. But, I mean all the time, how long had you been delivering ice at that saloon? A. Oh, about nine months, or so.
Q. About nine months or so? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And how long had you known the defendant, Donnelly?
A. Well, I guess I know him for going on two years and a half. Q. At least two years and a half; don't you?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And during those two years and a half, you had frequently
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come in contact with the defendant, Donnelly; hadn't you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You saw him at the saloon, when you delivered ice the nine months that you were engaged in that work? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then of an evening, after your work was over, you visited the saloon? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And for some considerable time, say, possibly two years, before you were delivering ice to the saloon, at
28th street and 8th Avenue, you knew the defendant, Donnelly? A. Well, I was slightly acquainted with him.
Q. Yes. You had been in the saloon; hadn't you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you had seen him in the morning?
A. Well, he was not in the saloon at the time. Q. In what saloon; 27th Street?
A. No, sir; 33rd Street, I believe.
Q. Well, you knew him in the saloon at 33rd Street and what avenue? A. Eighth Avenue.
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Q. And you also knew him as a bartender in the saloon at 28th Street and 8th Avenue? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And did you know him as a bartender in the saloon at 28th Street and 8th Avenue? A. No, sir.
Q. But for a period ranging between two years and three or four months, you had known him as a bartender between the saloon at 33rd Street and 8th Avenue, or 28th Street and 8th Avenue?
A. 27th Street.
Q. Yes; 27th Street? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you knew other people who knew him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Yes. Now, during the two years and three months that you had known this defendant, prior to the shooting, you had occasion to observe his conduct; hadn't you?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And up until this Sunday afternoon, when the shooting occurred, his conduct was always proper; was it not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You always found him to be peaceable and quiet? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And during all of those two years and three months that
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you had seen this defendant, when he was at 33rd Street and 8th Avenue, and at the 27th street and 8th Avenue saloon, you had always found him quiet and peaceable?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Had you, at any time before this Sunday, the 28th of May, 1893, seen him in any quarrel or fight at all? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you ever see him, during the two years and three months with the exception of this Sunday afternoon, when the shot was fired at Madden, attempt to commit any act of violence on any one at all?
A. No, sir; I didn't.
Q. No. And your observation of him had been, up to this one occasion, that he was a quiet and peaceable sort of man?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And, during all this time, he was a bartender, and had to contend with a great many people who came in for drinks?
(Objected.)
THE COURT: No; that will no do. You have gone far enough. You have shown that he was a quiet and peaceable man during all the time that he knew him.
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MR. HOUSE: What, sir?
THE COURT: You have shown him to be a quiet and peaceable man during the time that the witness knew him. MR. HOUSE: Very well, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now, what time did you say you got into the saloon this Sunday, afternoon Mr. Collins, just before the shooting?
A. I guess it was about a quarter-past 3.
Q. Yes. You entered there at a quarter-past 3? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was Donnelly in the saloon when you entered at that time? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Whereabouts was he? A. Behind the bar.
Q. Behind the bar. A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where was the other barkeeper, Madden---no, McCabe? A. He hadn't come home.
Q. He hadn't come home?
A. He was on. I beg your pardon there.
Q. That is it. Who was behind the bar when you first entered
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the saloon, at a quarter-after 3? A. McCabe?
Q. And how long after you entered that saloon was it before the defendant, Donnelly, went behind the bar? A. Five minutes past 4.
Q. Donnelly went behind the bar at five minutes-past 4? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, when you entered the saloon at a quarter-past 3, tell me, again, slowly, so that I can get it down, the people who were there?
A. There was me.
Q. You were one, and McCabe, the barkeeper, was two? A. Yes, sir.
A Charlie Madden.
Q. He was three?
A. Yes, sir. George Ruch. Q. George Ruch was four?
A. Yes, sir; and Daniel O'Keefe.
Q. And the five people that you have named at that time were the only people in that barroom at that time? A. Yes, sir. But may I ask you a question? Do you mean the time that Mr. Donnelly came in, or before?
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Q. No. I am talking of the time when you first entered the saloon at a quarter-past 3? A. Yes, sir. That was all that was in there.
Q. Now, you have asked me that question, and we want to get it right. You entered the saloon at a quarter-past
3 o'clock, at this Sunday afternoon? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you say that, when you got in McCabe, the other bartender, was there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And Madden was there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And Ruch was there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And O'Keefe was there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. So that, we have it now, as McCabe, Madden, O'Keefe and Rauch, as being in the saloon at the time you entered?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you say anything to Madden when you went into the saloon? A. Madden came in after I was in the saloon. I was in before him.
Q. But, a minute ago, you said when you went into the saloon, at a quarter after 3, that you found McCabe, the bartender, Rauch, O'Keefe and Madden in there?
A. No. Madden was not in there; Madden came in after-
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Q. Well, then, he was not in there. We went to fix that right. Now, go back. You entered the saloon at 3:15 that afternoon, as near as you can recollect?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, tell me, if you can, sir, the names of the persons that were in that saloon when you entered. BY THE COURT:
Q. Whom did you find in there at the moment that you entered?
A. All that I know that was in the saloon, that I was acquainted with, was the bartender. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. And that was McCabe?
A. Yes, sir. Rauch and O'Keefe I was not acquainted with at the time. Q. Rauch and O'Keefe you were not acquainted with at the time?
A. No, sir. They were strangers to me.
Q. But subsequently you did become acquainted with them, after the shooting? A. Yes, sir; after we got locked up.
Q. Yes; after you got locked up? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. But, before you went in that saloon, on that Sunday, they were strangers to you? A. Strangers to me.
Q. Yes. Now, how long had you been in that saloon before --- Madden came in, the fellow that was shot? A. I was there about five minutes.
Q. You were in there about five minutes? A. Yes, sir; when McCabe was on.
Q. That was when McCabe was on? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, then Madden must have come in about 20 minutes after three? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Yes. Was Donnelly in the saloon, this defendant; was he in the saloon at the time that Madden entered? A. No, sir.
Q. He was not? A. No. sir.
Q. Well, no, are you positive, Mr. Collins, that Madden entered that saloon five minutes after you got in? A. I should say it was about that.
Q. You should say it was about that? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Then, when you said to the District Attorney, in answer to his question, that it was five minutes after 4 when Madden came in, you were mistaken?
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MR. MCINTYRE: No; he said when the defendant came in. THE WITNESS: When the defendant came in.
MR. HOUSE: You said Madden. THE WITNESS: No; I didn't.
THE COURT: No; I think not. I asked him the question myself; how long after you entered the saloon did Madden come in, and I understood him to say about five minutes after.
MR. HOUSE: Yes, sir; but I took it down as five minutes after 4. THE COURT: I think not; but, of course, I may be mistaken.
MR. HOUSE: Very well, sir. I think I am right, but the Stenographer's Minutes will determine later. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now, you say that it was five minutes after you entered that Madden came in? A. He came in when the other bartender was on.
Q. Now, what were O'Keefe and Rauch doing at the time, if you recollect? A. They were there near the lunch-counter, against the
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side entrance, measuring their height between them. Q. Yes, measuring their height?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What was the first thing that Madden did after he entered the saloon, that Sunday afternoon? A. He had a cigar in his hand, and is the cigar that he was smoking, and he re-lighted it at the
cigar-lighter.
Q. He had a cigar that he was smoking, and he re-lighted it at the cigar-lighter? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, you are positive that he had been smoking that cigar before he came in? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Yes.
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And it was a half-smoked cigar that he went over to the cigar-lighter to light?
A. Well, I couldn't exactly say. I didn't take no attention to say whether it was half or three-quarters. Q. Half or three-quarters?
A. No, sir.
Q. But the cigar had been smoked before he went over to the lighter?
A. He re-lighted the cigar. I don't know how much it had been smoked off.
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Q. Now, do you know whether a portion of that cigar had been smoked before he went over to the cigar-lighter to relight it?
A. Well, I couldn't swear, but I thought, by the looks of it, that it had been smoked. I wouldn't swear to it.
THE COURT: Well, that is all. That is enough. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now, can you tell us whether or not, when he went to that cigar-lighter, that cigar had been lit at all? A. I could not.
Q. You could no? A. No, sir.
Q. Now, who was behind the bar at the time that Madden went over to the cigar-lighter? A. Mr. Donnelly.
Q. Mr. Donnelly?
A. No; the time---certainly Mr. Donnelly was behind the bar at the time. He had been in the saloon before, when Mr. McCabe was on.
Q. Well, I asked you a minute ago what Madden did first when he entered, when McCabe was behind the bar, and you said that he went over and re-lighted his cigar.
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A. Well, I thought *** you meant when Mr. Donnelly was behind the bar. Q. Now, if you will only pay attention to my questions, will get along.
THE COURT: No; that will do for the jury after a while. It is better to argue with the jury than with the witness.
MR. HOUSE: Very well, sir. I stand corrected. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now, I ask you again Mr. Collins, if you can tell me what was the first thing that you saw Madden do, after he entered that saloon, that Sunday afternoon?
A. At that time do you mean? BY THE COURT:
Q. Oh, no, no; the very moment that he came in. Did you see him come in the door? A. I did.
Q. Well, now, what was the first thing that you saw him do after he got into the door, after he got inside of the saloon?
A. Well, when he first came in, that is before Mr.
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Donnelly come---
Q. Well, never mind anything else. When he first came into the saloon, what was the first thing that he did? A. Well, at the time that Mr. Donnelly was on, he went over to the cigar-lighter first.
Q. Well, was that the first thing that you saw him so? A. Well, he was in there before that.
Q. Well, never mind about before. We will take it again. He was in the sale? You saw him come in; didn't you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Very well. Now, can't you tell us what was the first thing you saw him do then he came into the saloon? Leave out everybody else.
A. He went right to the cigar-lighter and lit the cigar.
Q. Now, who was behind the bar when at the time when the deceased lit the cigar? A. Mr. Donnelly.
BY MR. HOUSE: Q. Mr. Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What time did Mr. Donnelly come into that barroom?
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30
A. Five minutes past 4. Q. Five minutes past 4? A. Yes, sir.
Q. So that from 20 minutes after 3 o'clock until five minutes past 4, Madden had been in the saloon, before he went to the cigar counter to light his cigar; is that it?
BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, what was the first time that you saw him in there? A. About a quarter past 3.
Q. Did he go out then?
A. Yes, sir; he went out and went to where he works, to take care of his horses. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Did you go with him? A. No, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, he left the place? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. What door did he go out of? A. The side entrance.
Q. Did you see him go out of the side door, on to the street? A. I saw him go out of the door.
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31
Q. You saw him go out of the door? A. I did.
Q. Now, what I want to know is, and I must get it, too, if I can, Collins---you entered that saloon, according to your own testimony here to-day at a quarter-after 3; didn't you?
A. Yes, sir.
A. And you say that five minutes after you had entered the saloon that Charlie Madden came in; is that correct?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. So that, if you went in there at a quarter after 3, Madden must have come in there at 20 minutes after 3? A. Yes, sir; about.
Q. And Donnelly was not there at the time; was he? A. No, sir.
Q. Now, I don't care anything about Donnelly at this time. McCabe was behind the bar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, I will ask you, at 20 minutes after 3, when Madden, for the first time, as you say, came into that saloon, that Sunday afternoon, what was the very first thing that he did after he entered?
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32
A. He bought a glass of beer. Q. He bought a glass of beer? A. Yes, sir.
Q. From whom? A. From McCabe.
Q. Did he have a cigar in his mouth or in his hand at the time? A. Listen what I am saying; not at that time.
Q. I am asking you what he did at the time. BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, did you see, at the time that he asked for the glass of beer from McCabe---did he have a cigar in his hand at the time?
A. I didn't notice it. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. You did not notice it? A. No, sir.
Q. And, after he got the glass of beer from McCabe, what did you see Madden do? A. Nothing out of the way.
Q. I didn't ask you whether it was in or out of the way. What did he do? A. Well, after getting his glass of beer, he went out again.
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33
Q. Out of the side door? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, did you see him when he returned for the second time? A. I did.
Q. What time was it when he came in the second time? A. About five minutes past 4.
Q. About five minutes past 4? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you say that Donnelly came in at five minutes past 4 also?
A. Donnelly came on at five minutes past 4, and he happened to come at the same time. Donnelly had just got up behind the bar when he came in; it might be a minute or two difference.
Q. Did you see Donnelly when he came in first? A. I did.
Q. What was the first thing that he did? A. Donnelly put on his apron.
Q. Donnelly put on his apron?
A. Yes, sir; he took off his coat and hat and put on his apron. Q. Did you say anything to him?
A. I said, "How do you do, Jim?" Q. What did he say to you?
A. He said, "Hello, Pa***ddy:"
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34
Q. Did he appear to be pleasant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. He did not act cross? A. No, sir.
Q. He did not act as if he was angry?
A. He never did, as long as I knew him.
Q. And he appeared just as pleasant and quiet as you had always seen him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, the next thing that you saw, after Donnelly went behind the bar, was Madden coming in the door? A. Madden came in; yes, sir.
Q. Yes. Madden came into the door? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And what did Madden do, Donnelly being behind the bar? A. He went up to the cigar-lighter.
Q. Now, tell us --- you tell us that you do not know whether that cigar had been lit before or not. A. I wouldn't swear to it.
Q. You wouldn't swear to it? A. No, sir.
Q. But you saw him go over to the counter; didn't you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you looked at him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you saw that he had a cigar? A. Yes, sir.
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35
Q. And you couldn't tell us whether it had been lit before or not? A. No, sir.
THE COURT: Well, he has told us that half a dozen times already. That forecloses that matter. MR. HOUSE: Very well, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now, at which end of this bar is this cigar-lighter situated, or was it at the time? A. Just on the Northwest corner.
Q. And is that the end of the bar nearest to 8th Avenue? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Right on the 8th Avenue end of the bar? A. Yes, sir; on the uptown side.
Q. On the uptown side? A. Yes, sir.
Q. The bar has a round turn to it there, at the corner, has it not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, was the cigar lighter on the round turn, or a little way from it? A. Well, I should say about 8 or 10 inches or a foot from the turn of it.
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36
Q. From the turn?
A. Yes, sir; just right at the turn, pretty near.
Q. Now, whereabouts was Donnelly standing, in relation to his being behind the bar, at the time that Madden walked up to the cigar-lighter?
A. He was standing about four feet from the cigar-lighter, behind the bar. Q. Behind the bar?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And the first thing that you saw Madden do was to go up and light his cigar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. After he lit his cigar, what did Madden do, if anything? A. He asked for a glass of beer.
Q. Whom did he ask? A. Mr. Donnelly.
Q. Mr. Donnelly.
A. I went over that once before. BY THE COURT:
Q. I know, but, unfortunately, you will have to go over it again. Go on, Mr. House. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now, what did he say to Donnelly when he asked for the glass of beer? A. He said, "Give me a glass of beer."
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37
Q. And what did Donnelly say?
A. Donnelly says, "No, I will give you no glass of beer. Get out of, here, get out God damn you, get out. I
told you before to keep out of here."
Q. "I told you before to keep out of here"? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, do you recollect when you were before the Coroner's inquest you were asked to tell what Donnelly said to Madden, at the time he asked for the glass of beer, and just before the shooting?
A. What did I say?
Q. I ask you if you recollect that, when you were before the Coroner, you were asked to tell that Donnelly said to Madden, just before the shooting?
A. I do.
Q. And did you tell us then what was said by Madden and Donnelly? A. I think I did.
Q. You think you did? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, now, let us see. Do you remember this question being put to you, on page 6 of the Coroner's Minutes, by Mr. O'Hare, who represented the District Attorney's office, at that time; "Will you say what you saw and heard?
A. I came in about half-past 3, and I stood there until Mr. Donnelly came on, to relieve the other bartender, and Madden came in and stepped up to the cigar-lighter and lit
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38
his cigar." Was that question put to you before the Coroner, and to that question did you make that answer? A. It was.
Q. Yes. Now, see if this question was put to you: "Q. At half past 3? A. No; five minutes of 4; and he
(referring to Madden) asked Donnelly to give him a glass of beer. James Donnelly said, 'No, Get out. I told
you to keep out before.' He turned to the drawer and took out a revolver and shot him." How, did you make that answer?
A. I did.
Q. Well, now, if you were under oath, and your recollection on the 21st of July was just as clear regarding what took place in that saloon as it is now, why didn't you tell us at the Coroner's inquest that he said, "Get out of here, God damn you. I told you not to come in here any more"?
A. Well, that is hat he said; if I made a mistake. I don't care whether it is what he said or not. BY THE COURT:
Q. No, no. But why didn't you tell that to the Coroner, when you were asked that question? A. Well, I suppose nothing.
Q. What is that, sir?
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39
A. Well, I don't know. I thought I made the statement right, as far as I seen it. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. And that is your answer? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You thought that the statement that you made before the coroner was the right statement? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, here you did the words, "God damn you;" do you?
A. Well, no. I would leave that out. I would stick to my own first statement. Q. You would stick to your own first statement?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. So, now we have it that what Donnelly said to him was, "No. You can't have a drink. Get out of here. I told you before to stay out"?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, Mr. Collins, you think that he didn't say, "God damn you;' don't you?
A. No, I ain't---my recollection is again that way, but my first statement what I made is right. Q. The first statement that you made is correct?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. You say that, at the time the shot was fired, that Madden had his left arm resting on the bar? A. The bar rail.
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40
Q. On the bar rail? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you say that his right hand was down by his side? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Yes. Now Mr. Collins, how far away from Madden were you standing at the time the shot was fired? A. Just around the round corner of the bar.
Q. Just around the round corner of the bar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, show me on this diagram where you were standing.
A. Here is the cigar-lighter. I was standing around there, where the papers were. Q. Where the papers were?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, show me where Madden was standing at the time he was shot. A. Yes, sir.
Q. At the point marked B? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you were standing around at the point marked C? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, we will mark that.
THE COURT: Do you want to put another mark?
MR. HOUSE: Yes, sir; where he was standing at the time the shot was fired.
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41
THE COURT: He has already indicated it, at C.
MR. HOUSE: The witness says that, at the time the shot was fired, Madden was standing at the point indicated by B, gentlemen of the jury, and that the witness was standing at the point indicated by C.
THE 2ND JUROR: What is that? MR. HOUSE: That cross there.
THE JUROR: I thought Madden was standing here, where the cross is. No, B, where the cigar-lighter was.
THE COURT: No. There is where the deceased, he says, was standing at B. There is where he was standing, Marked
C, and there, he says, which is intended for a D, made by Mr. Martine, was where the defendant was standing. MR HOUSE: Yes, sir.
THE COURT: Now, we will make that D a little plainer, if you have no objection to my doing it. MR. HOUSE: Of course not, sir; not at all.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Mr. Collins, this bar that we have been speaking of is on
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42
the North side of the saloon; is it not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Yes. And Madden was standing, at the time the shot was fired, at the point that you have indicated here as
B, and that would be about how far from the turn of the bar, if you can give it? A. It was be about 3 feet or so.
Q. It would be about 3 feet or so? A. Yes, sir.
Q. About three feet away from the turn of the bar; and you were standing at the point indicated by C, which would be about 3 feet from the turn of the bar; would it not?
A. About that. Q. About that? A. Yes, sir.
Q. So that there would be a distance of about 6 or 7 feet on the turn of that bar, between you and Madden? A. Well, I wouldn't judge it over 4 feet.
Q. Well, over four?
A. Yes, sir; perhaps a little.
Q. Well, Madden stood two or three feet away from the turn of the bar? A. Yes, sir; about three feet.
Q. And you were about three feet from the turn of the bar? A. From the cigar-lighter, I mentioned.
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43
Q. Well, there is the cigar-lighter, and it is right at the turn of the bar. Now, were you right up against the bar at the time?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And were there any newspapers on the bar in front of you at the time? A. Yes, sir; the Sunday papers.
Q. And were you looking at them? V
Q. Now, when Madden was there you have indicated on the diagram, by the Mark B, and his left hand was resting on the bar, in the way which you have illustrated, his left side was to you; was it not?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, you are positive? A. Yes, sir.
Q. His left side was to you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And he was about 3 feet away from the turn of the bar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Immediately that the shot was fired, Madden started out the side door; did he? A. Staggered out, backwards.
Q. Well, you didn't follow out after him immediately?
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44
A. No, sir; I stood in the saloon. Q. You stood in the saloon?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Officer O'Neill came in; didn't he? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And Officer O'Neill asked who fired that shot?
A, He took the three names and asked who fired the shot. Q. And Donnelly said that he did?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was there any hesitancy on the part of Donnelly in saying that he fired the shot? A. No, sir.
Q. Owned it right up at once?
A. Yes, sir; he said, "I fired the shot."
Q. Now, after firing the shot, did Donnelly make any endeavor to get away, to get out of the saloon? A. No, sir.
Q. Did he stay right there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And when the officer asked him for the pistol, he handed it over directly to him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Didn't try to hide or conceal or keep it back? A. No, sir.
Q. Now, how long was Officer O'Neill in that saloon, taking your names and asking who fired the shot and getting the pistol from Donnelly, before you went out into the street?
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45
A. Well, I would say it was not five minutes any way to take three names.
Q. Well, you would say that it was not five minutes any way to take three names? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, it would take at least 3 or 4 minutes to do all that; wouldn't it? A. Yes, sir. He took the names and went out.
Q. Did he write them down? A. Yes, sir.
Q. On a piece of paper? A. Yes, sir.
Q. With a pencil? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And do you remember whether or not he searched this fellow Ruch or O'Keefe before he got the names? A. He didn't.
Q. He didn't? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You are positive that he didn't search anybody in that saloon before he asked who fired the shot? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, when you went out---Who went out into the street first, after the officer had got the names, and had asked who had fired the shot, and Donnelly had said, "I did," who went out first?
A. Mr. O'Neill.
Q. And who followed him? A. Ruch and O'Keefe.
Q. And where did you go? A. I went out.
Q. Where was Donnelly? A. He was behind the bar.
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46
Q. Didn't he take him out, at that time, the officer? A. Yes, sir; he did.
Q. Now, what I want to get at is: when the officer started out of the barroom with Donnelly, did you immediately follow them, or did Ruch and O'Keefe?
A. Ruch and O'Keefe went out first. Q. Ruch and O'Keefe went out first? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then you went out?
A. Yes, sir. I stopped in the saloon until I saw that Tommy went on, and Mr. O'Neill took Donnelly out, and then I followed them out.
Q. Yes. And then you followed them out? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then O'Keefe and Ruch went out first? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then Officer O'Neill and Donnelly went out? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then you stayed in there long enough to see that the other bartender went behind the door again? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then you went out?
A. He come right on, when he come in; but he went to the closet at the time that the affray happened.
Q. Yes. But O'Keefe and Ruch and Officer O'Neill and Donnelly had got out of the door, on the street, before you did?
A. I followed O'Neill---I followed Officer O'Neill and
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47
Donnelly right out. I was right behind them. Q. You were right behind them?
A. I was.
Q. Now, where was Madden lying at the time? A. Right on the sidewalk, at the side entrance. Q. In front of the saloon?
A. Well, at the side entrance. BY THE COURT:
Q. He was lying on the sidewalk in front of the side entrance? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now, were there many people around him? A. Yes, sir; quite a crowd.
Q. How many, about?
A. Well, I should judge---I couldn't say exactly---but I should judge about 100 or 150 people. Q. You should judge about from 100 to 150 people?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Were they right close up around him? A. They were.
Q. Right near him?
A. Well, yes; gathered around, the same as if any accident happened. Q. Well, did you know any of those people at the time that were there? A. I didn't.
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48
Q. Now, have you since leaned that you knew any of them? A. I didn't.
Q. You say that you have no particular place of residence at present, Mr. Collins; is that so? A. Not at present.
THE COURT: Is he in the House of Detention? THE WITNESS: I was.
MR. MCINTYRE: No, sir; he was in the House of Detention, but was liberated on a bond. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Well, you were not very long in the House of Detention? A.
A couple of days and nights.
Q. So that, along in the month of June, 1893, you were taken out of the House of Detention on bond; weren't you?
A. Yes, sir; I was.
Q. And you have not been back in the house of detention since; have you? A. I was.
Q. For how long?
A. No; I was not taken down there, but I was taken down to "The Market," again, after leaving the employ that
I was at.
BY THE COURT:
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49
Q. No. Let us see. When did you leave the House of Detention; about? A. Well, I couldn't tell the date.
Q. Well, was it in June? A. It was in June.
Q. You think it was in June? A. It was.
Q. And were you let out on bail, then? A. Yes, Your Honor.
Q. And did you then go back to the House of Detention again?
A. No. The lady that I was working for, after leaving her employment, she surrendered herself, and I had to get another bondsman.
Q. And were you a day or so getting another bondsman?
A. No, sir; the same do I was arrested. I was taken out of the house, and I got the bail before I left "The
Market".
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. So that you were only locked up in the house of Detention about two or three days? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, when did you leave Mrs. Glascow's employ, Mr. Collins? A. That I couldn't exactly tell you, the date.
Q. Well, it was along last summer some time, was it not? A. It was.
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50
Q. What is her son's name; George? A. I have no son, sir.
Q. Mrs. Glascow has no son? A. Oh, Mrs. Glascow?
Q. Yes?
A. Oh, she was two sons.
Q. Well, which one of them was it that used to go on the wagon with you, once in a while? A. That is William.
Q. That is William? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And did you leave her employ yourself, or were you discharged? A. Well, she discharged me because I abused the boy.
Q. Yes. You and her son had a fight? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you abused him; you licked him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And because of that Mrs. Glascow discharged you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And have you had any employment since then? A. Yes, sir. I have been working off and on.
Q. Well, whom have you been working for since then?
A. Well, I have been working down around the dock. I got odd jobs, putting in coal or anything. Q. Well, you haven't had a steady job since?
A. No, sir.
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51
It was pretty hard to get it this winter.
Q. Yes. Nor since you were discharged by Mrs. Glascow, you haven't had any steady place of residence; have you?
A. No; no steady place of residence.
Q. And then you had no particular place of residence? A. No, sir.
Q. Or no particular place where you have worked? A. No, sir.
Q. Were you born in Boston, Mr. Collins? A. I was.
Q. When did you come to this City, about, to live? A. When did I come to this City?
Q. Yes; to New York?
A. Well, I couldn't exactly tell you. I went off and on there. BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, about when was the first time, about how many years ago? A. About ten years ago.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. About 10 years ago? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And have you been steadily a resident of the City of
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52
New York, for the past ten years?
A. Well, I have made two strips to Boston in that time. Q. You have made two trips to Boston in that time?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long did you remain in Boston during those two trips? A. Not over a week.
Q.
A little over a week, each time? BY THE COURT:
Q. Not over a week each time? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. So that, having come to the City of New York, about ten years ago, and having made, during that time, two trips to Boston, of not over a week each time, you have been a resident of New York right through?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, who did you first go to work for, when you came first to New York? A. The New York Co-operative Lead Works.
Q. The New York Co-operative lead Works? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long did you work for them? A. About a year.
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53
Q. And after you left them where did you go?
A. I get hurt in the New York Cooperative lead Works, and I was shifted down to T. J. Pope & Sons, on Pearl
Street.
Q. Well, how long did you work for them?
A. Well, it is the same firm; and I stood there as a porter. Q. For how long?
A. Ey?
Q. For how long?
A. Well, I was over a year.
Q. That is two years. And then, after you left down there, where did you go? A. Eh?
BY THE COURT:
Q. When you left Pope's, where did you go? A. I worked for Skidmore & Sons.
BY MR HOUSE:
Q. The coal people? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And how long did you work for them? A. About a year or so.
Q. Well, you guess so?
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54
A. I said about a year or so.
Q. Now, which was it; a year or two years? A. Well, about year and three months.
Q. About a year and three months? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And, after you left Skidmore, where did you go? A. I went to work for Scott.
Q. He is in the ice business? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long did you work for Mr. Scott? A. Four years.
Q. Four years? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And, after you left Mr. Skidmore, where did you go?
A. I went boating for the New York Central & Hudson R.R.Co. I wasn't exactly boating for them. BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, what did you do for them?
A. Oh, I was on the boat that they call the "Houghataling." BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. How long were you there? A. About a year.
Q. Did you ever make a trip to Havana? A. Yes, sir.
Q. On a coasting steamer? A. Yes, sir.
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55
Q. As a coal passer? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What was the name of the fellow that used to work with you on the wagon as a helper, shortly before the shooting---Bob Clifford, was it?
A. Bob Clifford---let me see? BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, what was the name of the man that used to work with you as helper on your wagon?
A. His first name is Bob. I don't remember now what his last name was. His first name was Bob, any way. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Well, Bob had charge of the wagon, while you were down at the coroner's inquest; did he not? A. He did.
Q. And he made some collections?
MR. ICINTYRE: Well, what has that got to do with this case. I object. MR. HOUSE: Well, I am just asking the question, yes or no.
THE COURT: Well, why? What materially has it in this case? MR. HOUSE: Well, I will withdraw the question.
BY MR. HOUSE:
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56
Q. Well, he was discharged shortly after you had given your testimony before the Coroner; was he not? A. He was.
Q. Yes.
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And do you recollect of having any conversation with anybody regarding the reason for his discharge? (Objected to, as immaterial.)
THE COURT: Well, that is immaterial. It is certainly material at this stage of the case. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Did you say to any person, after his discharge, that he had been discharged for collecting $8.00, an ice bill, while you were before the Coroner, and keeping it?
(Objected to, an immaterial.)
THE COURT: I will exclude it. I do not see the materiality of it. (Exception.)
BY MR HOUSE:
Q. And did you tell any one, in the course of a conversation, that it was easy for the drive of an ice wagon to skin the boss?
MR. MCINTYRE: Well, I will not object to it.
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57
It is a matter of common knowledge.
THE COURT: I will allow it, as it may tend to affect his credibility. A. I didn't.
BY MR. HOUSE: Q. What?
A. I didn't.
Q. Now, Collins, do you mean to swear under your oath, that within a short time after you had been a witness before the Coroner, upon the Madden inquest, if, in a conversation with a certain person, you referred to the fact that Bob had been discharged for stealing $8.00, which he had collected while you were there; that you did not relate to a certain person the various tricks in the ice business, and show how the driver could skin
the boss, and how the driver upon the wagon could always make a little money for himself? A. Did you ever see an honest iceman?
THE COURT: Now, you can answer that question.
MR. HOUSE: And, judging from my ice bills, I should say not. THE COURT: Never mind about that. Repeat that ques-
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58
tion, Mr. Stenographer. (Question repeated.)
A. I didn't remark it. BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, whom did you say it to?
A. That I don't remember; but I didn't say no $8.00.
Q. You did say part of it, and not the part relating to the $8.00? A. No, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. But the rest you did speak of, but not the part relating to the $8? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know a fellow by the name of Kiernan before the shooting? A. I did.
Q. Yes. And also a fellow by the name of Davis? A. I did.
Q. Well, you were on very good---friendly terms with Kiernan and Davis for some time prior to the shooting;
were you not?
A. I was in friends with all of them. Q. Friends with all of them?
A. Yes, sir.
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59
Q. But not friends with O'Keefe and Ruch before the shooting? A. I didn't know them, at that time.
Q. But, since the shooting you have become quite familiar with them?
A. I got acquainted with them by being in court and in the House of Detention with them. Q. Hadn't you met them anywhere else?
A. Not before the shooting.
Q. But, I say, since the time of the shooting, haven't you met Ruch and O'Keefe? BY THE COURT:
Q. Or at any other time than when you were in the House of Detention? A. No, sir; and only when we were ordered to come to court.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. And only when you were ordered to come to court? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, you know where the Oak saloon is, at 23rd Street and 8th Avenue, down in the basement; don't you? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. Do you mean to tell me that Ruch and you and another party did not meet in that saloon one night? A. We didn't.
Q. You are positive? A. Yes, sir; I am.
Q. And the man that was with Ruch you said had been your partner for some time, and you asked Ruch where he got acquainted with him?
A. My partner?
Q. Yes; had been a partner of yours, after Bob left the wagon? BY THE COURT:
Q. Now, let us see, Mr. House. Now, you are talking of a meeting in the Oak saloon at 23rd Street and 8th
Avenue?
MR. HOUSE: Yes, sir; 23rd Street and 8th Avenue.
THE COURT: Now, he says that he was not there, and did not meet those people, and that ought to end that. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now, let us see, Mr. Collins. Do you know where you were---were you in the oak saloon, at the corner of
23rd Street on 8th Avenue on the night of the 19th of August, last? A. I could not tell you.
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Q. You couldn't tell? A. No, sir.
Q. And don't you remember that, upon that night, that while you were in there, Ruch and another man came in, and that you said, "Hello. We haven't met since we were before the coroner's jury"?
MR. MCINTYRE: Don't answer that. That is assuming, Your Honor, that he was there.
THE COURT: Well, he has said that he can't tell whether he was there or not. I will allow it, on that ground. BY THE COURT:
Q. Now, having heard that question, do you recollect whether you were in the oak saloon on the night of the
19th of August?
A. I don't recollect.
Q. Now, did you make any such statement as is referred to, to anybody, on the night of the 19th of August, or on any night in August in that saloon?
A. I don't remember it; and if I did, I don't remember it.
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BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. And do you remember that, after you had got in there, and had had several drinks--- THE COURT: Now, you are assuming that he was there.
You can get *** at it in some other way than by assuming that he was in there. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Very well, sir. Did you ever have any conversation with Ruch about a little fellow from the Herald coming to see you?
A. From the Herald?
Q. Yes; from the Herald.
A. I don't know anybody that works in the Herald. Q. I didn't ask you whether you did or not.
A. The Herald office, do you mean?
THE COURT: What Herald, the newspaper? MR. HOUSE: Yes, sir; the Herald office.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q.
A little fellow who claimed to be working in the Herald office? A. No, sir.
Q. You never had any conversation with Ruch about that?
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A. No, sir.
Q. And Ruch said, "The Mugsey has been to see me. Has he been to see you?" A. No, sir.
THE COURT: Well, he says he had no such conversation. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. And you said that you had heard of the 'bloke' and that he had been to see O'Keefe and Davis? MR. MCINTYRE: Well, he says that he don't remember it.
THE WITNESS: I don't remember of hearing it; not to my knowledge have I heard any such thing. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. And you say that that is not so? A. Not to my knowledge.
Q. How many times have you been in saloons drinking with Ruch, since this shooting, Mr. Collins? A. Very few; I guess it is about twice.
Q. About twice?
A. That is something---he don't keep company with me and I don't keep company with him. THE COURT: That will do. That is an answer.
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BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. That fellow, Bob, that used to work with you as a helper; do you remember his name as being Bob Cawfield? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know where he is now, Mr. Collins? A. I don't.
Q. How long after the shooting was it that you were discharged by Mrs. Glascow? A. That I could not exactly tell you.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, as near as you can?
A. Oh, it was four months or so; three or four months. Q. Three or four months?
A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Do you know a man by the name of Barney McCullagh, who was employed by Dr. Betts? A. Barney McCullagh?
Q. Yes?
A. I know a man named Barney McCullagh, but I don't
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know whether he is employed by Dr. Betts or not. BY THE COURT:
Q. Do you know a man by that name? A. I know a man by that name.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Do you know whereabouts McCullagh lives? A. I don't, sir.
DANIEL O'KEEFE, called by the People, being duly sworn, testified as follows: Direct-Examination.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Mr. O'Keefe, what is your business? A. Tin and sheet-iron worker.
Q. And where is your place of business? A. 433 AND 435 West 42nd Street.
Q. Were you engaged in that business on or about may 28th, of last year? A. Yes, sir.
Q. At that time where did you reside, Mr. O'Keefe? A. 242
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West 19th Street.
Q. Do you remember on the afternoon of the 28th day of may, 1893, being in the saloon owned by one Felix
Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where was that saloon situated? A. On 28th Street and 8th Avenue. Q. In the City of New York?
A. In the City of New York.
Q. What time did you go there?
A. Well, I should judge about 4 o'clock in the afternoon; between 3 and 4. Q. You should judge about 4 o'clock in the afternoon; between 3 and 4? A. Yes, sir.
Q. In whose company did you go? A. Mr. George Ruch.
Q. Mr. George Ruch? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, where had you met Ruch, previous to going to the saloon? A. I met him at 29th Street between 9th and 10th Avenue.
Q. And went from that point--- A. On my way home.
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Q. And from that point you went to the saloon kept by Felix Donnelly?
A. I stopped in there, in the afternoon, on my way home, to dinner, to have a glass of beer. Q. And you fix the time as between 3 and 4 o'clock?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And when you got into the saloon, whom did you see in there? A. Well, I didn't know anybody when I got in there.
BY THE COURT:
Q. There were people in there, however?
A. Yes, sir; but I didn't know who they were.
Q. Well, about how many people did you see when you went in there? A. Well, there were two, in my judgment.
Q. Two people? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Exclusive of the bartender?
A. Well, there was a bartender there that served me, and there were two bartenders afterwards. Q. No. I am talking of the number of people that you remember
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seeing in the saloon when you went in, and you Mr.---what is his name? A. Mr. George Ruch.
Q. You went in there together? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And when you went in, how many people did you see, about, if you recollect?
A. Well, there were the bartender, Mr. Collins, Mr. Ruch and myself. That was four. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Well, when you got into the saloon, or rather, how did you enter the saloon? A. Through the side entrance, on 28th Street.
Q. Through the side entrance on 28th Street? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And when you got into the saloon, what did you do? A. I called for a glass of beer.
Q. Were you served with the glass of beer? A. I was.
Q. And did your friend, Ruch, have a glass of beer, too? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And after you got the glass of beer what did you do in the saloon?
A. Well, Mr. Ruch and I got arguing between our heights and measurements. He claimed he was taller than I was,
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and I claimed I was taller than him; and the argument came to measurements, and we went over to the side entrance of the saloon.
Q. To the side entrance of the saloon? A. Yes, sir; the 28th Street entrance.
Q. And what was there near that door---a machine to measure with? A. No, sir; we just measured it off with a pencil.
Q. On the wall?
A. No, sir; on to the partition that was there, at the side entrance. Q. Now, how long were you engaged in doing that?
A. Well, I don't know. I couldn't exactly say the time, but about ten or fifteen minutes, probably. Q. And that brought you down to what time, as near as you can remember.
A. Well, I can't remember at the present time, how long it did take, but probably half an hour altogether, between the two drinks we had.
Q. Well, while you were measuring, did you see the defendant at the bar?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where did he come from?
A. Well, I believe he came in the side entrance. Who is that you are speaking about? Q. The defendant at the bar.
A. Mr. Donnelly? Is that it? Q. Yes.
THE COURT: Stand up, defendant. Now, when did you see that man first?
A. I seen him come into the side entrance. I couldn't tell the time, though, and I believe he went behind the bar.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. And, when he went behind the bar, was there another bartender there?
MR. HOUSE: Well, Your Honor. I must object to the District Attorney leading the witness. It is not fair or proper.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Now, did you see a bartender behind the bar when you went in? A. Yes, sir.
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BY THE COURT:
Q. Now, you and Mr. Ruch went in to have a glass of beer before your dinner, you say? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And did you have a glass of beer, before you measured yourselves? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And did you have a glass of beer, before you measured yourselves? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And who was behind the bar, then?
A. Thomas McCabe, I believe, was behind the bar. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. And it was after you got the glass of beer that you saw the defendant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then he came in through the side door? A. Yes, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q. The side entrance? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. And where did he go?
A. Behind the bar, as far as I saw him.
Q. And did you see what became of McCabe, then?
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A. I saw him go into the closet.
Q. You saw him go into the closet? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, did you know Charles Madden? A. I didn't, sir.
Q. Well, did you see anybody there whose name you learned afterwards to be that of Charles Madden? A. I did. I heard of it after the case.
Q. You did; you heard of it after the case? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, the man that you heard of as being Charles Madden, did you see him in the saloon on that occasion? A. I saw his back, but I couldn't recognize his face.
Q. Where was he standing? A. At the end of the bar.
Q. And who was he talking to?
MR. HOUSE: Objected to. "Was he talking with anybody?" I suppose, would be the fair question, Your Honor. THE COURT: Yes, it is not exactly fair, but he is getting into your way of examining witnesses, Mr. House. MR. HOUSE: Then, he should object, Your Honor.
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THE COURT: Well, it is very easy to get along, without all this discussion.
THE WITNESS: Well, as far as I saw, he was leaning ever the bar, talking to the bartender, as far as I could see.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Now, at what end of the bar, Mr. Witness? A. At the 8th Avenue entrance.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Now, you say that he was talking to the bartender? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What bartender, if you know?
A. Well, at the time we were measuring heights, he was talking to Donnelly. Q. The defendant here?
A. Yes, sir; the defendant.
Q. Now, how were they talking; in a loud way or quiet?
A. No, sir; in a quiet way, as far as I could see. I was close enough to hear it. Q. In a quiet way?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, during the course of the conversation that you have
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just described, did anything attract your attention, on that occasion? A. The movements of the men; that is about all.
Q. Well, what men? A. Why Donnelly.
Q. Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you see him? BY THE COURT:
Q. No, no. Now, please, Mr. Witness, go right on and tell us what you saw and what you heard, commencing at that point.
A. Well, at that point---
Q. Slow and loud. All that you saw and heard said in that saloon. A. Well, I heard the report of a pistol.
Q. Yes; go on. And what did you do?
A. And I faced about---I didn't have to face about. I just merely took a side glance of my eyes, and I saw Mr. Donnelly return the pistol to the drawer; and, with that, I made a motion to go to the side door, and I was stopped
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by the officer coming in. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Now, when you heard the report of the pistol, did you see anybody standing at the then? A. There was one man standing at the end of the bar.
Q. Yes. Well, who was that man? A. Collins.
Q. And he stood at the extreme end of the bar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, now, did you notice anybody who was injured or hurt? A. Well, this Madden. He staggered past me.
Q. He claimed he was shot? A. Yes.
Q. Did you hear him say anything? A. He said "that man shot me."
Q. He said, "That man shot me"? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Pointing to what man? A. Well, he did not say.
Q. Well, where did he go to?
A. He went out of the side entrance. I don't know where he went to afterwards.
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Q. After you heard that declaration, "That man shot me" was it then that Officer O'Neill came in? A. He came in the side door; yes.
Q. What did O'Neill do, the officer?
A. He stopped first Ruch, who was in front of me, going out of the side door, and he asked who fired the shot, and Ruch said he didn't, and he asked me who did it, and I said I didn't, and then the bartender claimed that he did it.
Q. What did he say? A. "I shot the man."
Q. Then, what next did you see?
A. That is all I saw of it, Your Honor. Q. Did you leave the saloon then?
A. I left the saloon then. Q. By the side entrance?
A. Yes; by the side entrance.
Q. Did you see the man on the sidewalk?
A. I didn't. I didn't stop; there was too much of a crowd there. Q. And you left directly, after seeing the deceased on
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the sidewalk? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Now, I want you to indicate, on this diagram, where the man---
THE COURT: You had better let him look at it first. There is the 8th Avenue, and there is 28th Street. MR. MCINTYRE: This indicates the bar.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Now, state, if you can, where you saw the man Collins standing. AL Well, this is the bar?
Q. Yes.
A. Collins was standing about there (indicating), where it is marked here. THE COURT: He indicates the same place as Collins did.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. And the man who was shot, where was he standing? A.
A little below this circle of the bar.
BY THE COURT: Q. You indicate B?
A. Yes, sir; about that.
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BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. And the defendant at the bar, where was he standing at the time? A. About there (indicating).
THE COURT: He indicates the same place as the other witness. BY THE SECOND JUROR:
Q. Now, where were you standing? BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. The juror wants to know about where you were standing. THE COURT: When the shot was fired?
THE JUROR: Yes, sir.
THE WITNESS: I was standing about a foot this way inside of the door, at the side entrance. THE COURT: Now, mar that. I will mark it E. I will make a cross and E.
THE WITNESS: About a foot inside of that entrance. That extends inside of the store, you know. I was standing about a foot inside of that.
THE COURT: Let the jury see that.
MR. MCINTYRE: The witness indicates that he was standing right there---you see it, gentlemen---by the side
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79 entrance.
THE COURT: We may as well suspend here. Now, gentlemen, the statute requires me, on every occasion when the jury separate, and before they agree upon a verdict, to admonish the jury that they must not speak, even among themselves, in reference to the case; that they must not make up their minds on the question of the guilt or innocence, until the entire case is presented; and that, of course, they must not, under any circumstances,
permit any person to approach them or speak with them in reference to the case.
I have called your attention specifically to what the law requires me to do; and, instead of repeating it hereafter, I will ask you to bear that admonition in mind, and to obey it.
You will be here at a quarter-past 2 o'clock.
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CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR HOUSE:
Q. Mr. O'Keefe, at the time of this shooting, I believe, you were residing with your parents at 242 West 19th. Street, in this City.
A. Yes, sir.
Q. You are a tin-smith by trade, are you? A.
A sheet iron worker.
Q. For the last three or four years have you had any steady employment or have you been working at your brother's.
A. Mostly, yes.
Q. So that during the last two years you really had no steady employment except at your brother's? A. That is it.
Q. Who have you been working for in the last few years? A. Gillis & Geoghegan and Bonnell & Court.
Q. You have got a couple of brothers who are working in a tin store? A. One.
Q. You sometimes work for him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You knew Madden in his lifetime?
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A. I did not know him.
Q. You didn't know him at all? A. No.
Q. Do you know a fellow by the name of Kiernan? A. I do not.
Q. Do you know a fellow by the name of Charles Davis or did you at that time? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You say that you were around there frequently with Kiernan? A. Well, it was a little later I got acquainted with Kiernan.
Q. Before the shooting you didn't know Madden at all?
A. I did not. I never saw him before in my life. I would not recognize the man to day. Q. Possibly not?
A. I don't suppose I would.
Q. Madden was a good sized man, was he not?
A. I only saw the back of him and I could not tell you.
Q. Well, now, the greater part of the afternoon when you were in that saloon you were engaged with your friend
Ruch in measuring yourselves?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you were paying more attention to what you were doing than to what anyone else was doing in the saloon?
A. Slightly, yes.
Q. So that when the defendant first got the pistol, you did not see it? A. I did not see it taken out, no.
Q. And the first that you knew that there was anybody having any trouble there in that saloon was when you heard the report of it?
A. Yes, that was it.
Q. At the time you heard the report of the pistol you and Ruch were measuring yourselves, were you not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, you say that you heard some little conversation passing between some persons in the saloon but what that conversation was you do not know?
A. I do not know, no.
Q. You really don't know who it was that was talking? A. I saw the bartender and this man Madden talking. Q. But what they were talking about you don't know? A. I don't know.
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Q. As a matter of fact, you did not pay any attention at all? A. Not particularly, I did not.
Q. Immediately after you heard the shot, what did this man Madden do, that you recall now? A. He claimed that he was shot.
Q. Did he go out of the side door?
A. He went out of the side door, yes.
Q. Immediately after he went out of the side door did the police officer appear upon the scene? A. In through the side door---Ruch and I were on the way out.
Q. Ruch and you were on your way out and you came in contact with the police officer? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then you went back in the saloon? A. The officer put us back in the saloon.
Q. Was the officer in uniform? A. Yes, sir.
Q. He asked if you fired the shot? A. Yes.
Q. Did he ask the same question of Ruch?
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A. Oh, yes.
Q. Both of you denied it? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then what did the officer do? A. He asked Donnelly.
Q. What did Donnelly say?
A. He said he had shot the man.
Q. You were present when the officer asked Donnelly that? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did Donnelly show any hesitancy when he answered that? A. Not as far as I seen.
Q. As far as you saw, there was no hesitancy by him at all? A. No.
Q. He said, "Yes, I fired the shot?" A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then do you know what the officer did with Donnelly? A. I don't---took him outside, as far as I saw.
Q. Did you go outside after that? A. I did.
Q. Did you see Madden lying down?
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A. I did not.
Q. Was there ambulance there at the time? A. No, there was not.
Q. You did not wait for that? A. I went right off.
Q. That is all you know about it? A. That is all I know about it.
Q. Now, Mr. O'Keefe, tell me as near as you recollect what time it was you entered that saloon this Sunday afternoon?
Q. I think it was somewhere between 3 and 4 o'clock, as I have said.
Q. Was Donnelly, the defendant, in there when you entered the saloon? A. Not at the time.
Q. Are you sure?
A. Well, I am pretty sure of it. Q. You got a drink of beer?
A. I did.
Q. Your friend did? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Who served you the beer?
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A. I forget the man's name--- Q. McCabe?
A. McCabe, yes.
Q. See if you don't recollect that before you went into the saloon that you and Ruch were standing at the side door and the defendant went in before you?
A. I don't recollect that. We didn't stand there at all. We came right up from 29th. Street.
Q. You came right up from 29th, Street and went inside of the saloon between half past three and four o'clock?
A. Somewheres around about that time.
Q. You are positive that it was the other bartender who served you? A. We had two drinks.
Q. Did you get one of those from this defendant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And McCabe served you the other? A. McCabe served the other.
Q. And the defendant Donnelly served you with a drink before the shooting? A. Yes, before the shooting.
A. At that time he appeared pleasant, didn't he? A. He seemed to. I did not know the man.
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BY THE COURT:
Q. So far as his appearance was concerned? A. He seemed to be all right enough.
GEORGE RUCH, a witness called on behalf of the people, being duly sworn, testified as follows. DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Mr. Ruch, what business are you engaged in?
A. I am taking care of a house, now, a janitor at present. Q. Where?
A. In 36th. Street between Eighth and Ninth Avenues.
Q. What business were you engaged in on the 28th day of May last? A. Tending bar.
Q. For whom?
A. Daniel O'Shea.
Q. Where was his place of business? A. 334 West 36th. Street.
Q. Where did you live on the 28th day of May last? A. 319 West 36th Street.
Q. On the afternoon of May 28th, 1893, do you remember
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meeting anybody?
A. Yes, Daniel O'Keefe.
Q. Where did you meet him?
A. On 29th. Street between Ninth and Tenth Avenues. Q. After your meeting him where did you go?
A. We walked over towards Eighth Avenue and 28th. Street. Q. Into what place did you go, if into any place?
A. Into Donnelly's. Q. Situated where?
A. 26th. Street---on the northeast corner of 28th Street and the Avenue. Q. In the City of New York?
A. In the City of New York.
Q. What time was it when you went into that saloon?
A. It might have been around half past three, or something like that. Q. When you went into that saloon, what did you have, if anything? A. We each had a glass of beer.
Q. Who waited on you? A. The other bartender.
Q. Do you know his name?
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A. No, sir.
Q. When you went into the saloon with O'Keefe, who did you see there that you recognized? A. Well, there was another gentleman I did not know at the time.
Q. Did you learn his name since? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What is his name? A. Patrick Collins.
Q. Who else did you see there?
A. Then about that time James Donnelly walked in? Q. The defendant at the bar?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you observe from what direction he came? BY THE COURT:
Q. Did he come in the front door or in the side door? A. The side door.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Where did he go to? A. Behind the bar.
Q. Was there anybody else behind the bar when he went behind the bar? A. No, sir. The other man was going toward the closet.
Q. What did you do after Donnelly went behind the bar?
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A. We went over towards the side door and we began measuring ourselves. Q. You and O'Keefe?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long did you stay there making your measurements? A. Well, about twenty minutes---fifteen or twenty.
Q. While you were doing that did you see anybody that you recognized at the bar on the outside of it? A.
A young fellow there.
Q. Did you know who he was? A. No.
Q. Have you since learned? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What is his name? A. Charles Madden.
Q. Where was he standing?
A. Right at the end of the bar, toward the front door.
Q. What was he doing there? did you see him doing anything? A. No, sir. I was not looking that way---towards Eighth Avenue. Q. Did you see anybody behind the bar?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. Who did you see behind the bar? A. James Donnelly.
Q. The defendant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where was he, what part of the bar?
A. Right towards the Eighth Avenue end of it.
Q. Was he holding a conversation at that time with anybody that you saw? A. I did not hear. They had their own private conversation, whatever it was. BY THE COURT:
Q. Was he apparently talking to anybody at the time? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you see him talking? A. No, sir.
Q. You were not asked to tell what was said. Did you see anybody speak to him or he speak to anybody? A. They were speaking to each other. I did not hear any conversation.
Q. He was behind the bar? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. How many were outside? A. Only two.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Now, while those two people were in the relative positions that you have described, did anything attract your attention?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What was it?
A. The report of a pistol.
Q. And in consequence of a report of a pistol did you look in any direction? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Which way?
A. Toward the bartender? Q. What did you see?
A. He opened a drawer and put the pistol back in the drawer. Q. Did you see anything else after that?
A. No, sir.
Q. What became of the man who was standing at the end of the bar?
A. He went toward the side door holding his hand towards his left side and he said, 'I am shot."
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Q. Did the bartender Donnelly say anything? A. No, sir; I didn't hear him.
Q. After the man said, "I am shot," where did he go? A. Outside on the sidewalk.
Q. Where did you go then?
A. We went right out after the officer had our names. Q. The officer came in and asked you your names? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you hear the officer say anything to the bartender Donnelly?
A. Yes. He asked him who it was that done it. He asked me at first if I done it and I says, "No." He asked us
all and then he went to the bartender and asked him and he said, "Yes." He asked him for the revolver and took him along?
Q. Took Donnelly along? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you go away then? A.
A little after than.
Q. Did you see Donnelly with the officer in the presence of Madden outside? A. I did.
Q. Did you hear any conversation between those three men
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namely, the officer, Donnelly and Madden?
A. The officer asked Madden if he knew who it was that shot him and he says, "James Donnelly." Q. What else did he say? What else did Madden say?
A. He said he didn't do a damned thing. He asked him for a glass of beer and he shot him. Q. Did he say, "I asked him for a glass of beer and he shot me?"
A. Yes, sir.
Q. The defendant was there when that was said? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And the officer? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And the officer put the questions in the presence of the defendant to Madden? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And in response to a question such as I have just suggested by the officer to the deceased, he said "I
didn't do a damned thing; I asked him for a glass of beer and he shot me?" A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was there any quarreling that you observed in the store?
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A. No, sir; I didn't see any. Q. Everything was quiet? A. Everything was quiet.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Mr. Ruch, where was O'Keefe at the time you heard the conversation between the officer, madden and the defendant?
A. He was right at the side door inside. Q. He was not out on the street then? A. No, sir. We were both inside.
Q. You were both inside of the door? A. In the saloon.
Q. At the time I am asking you now, Mr. Ruch---by the way, I will withdraw that. You were not present in Court when O'Keefe was testifying, were you?
A. No, sir.
Q. You do not know what O'Keefe testified to? A. No, sir.
Q. Now, I ask you, at the time that the officer had Donnelly and asked Madden who shot him and Madden said, "It was Donnelly; I asked him for a glass of beer and didn't do a damned thing," where was O'Keefe?
A. I don't know where he went to.
Q. You don't know where he went to?
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A. No.
Q. Didn't you go away with O'Keefe?
A. I did after Madden went away in the ambulance. I met him again and we walked off together. Q. Where did you meet him?
A. At the corner of 28th. Street.
Q. So that you don't know whether O'Keefe was near the officer and Donnelly at the time this conversation took place or not?
A. No, sir.
Q. Who did you say you were working for on the 28th day of May, 1893? A. Daniel O'Shea.
Q. Whereabouts is Mr. O'Shea's place? A. At present?
Q. Yes.
A. He is not in business any more.
Q. Where was his place at the time you were working for him. A. 344 West 36th Street.
Q. How long did you work for Mr. Daniel O'Shea? A. About six months.
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Q. Before you went to work for Mr. O'Shea who did you work for? A. I was taking care of the same house I am now.
Q. Were you taking care of the house or is your mother taking care of it and are you helping her? A. I am doing work around the house.
Q. Who is recognized as the janitress there, isn't she? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you are her assistant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long has your mother been janitress of those premises? A. About four years.
Q. During those four years you have been assisting her, more or less, have you not, as her assistant in helping her take care of the promises?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, the tenants in that property that your mother and you have supervision over are sporting people, are they not, a good many of them?
MR. McINTYRE: Objected to.
THE COURT: How is that the question in this case? MR. HOUSE: I am leading up to the question.
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THE COURT: Come right down to the point and lead up to it afterwards.
Q. Well, Mr. Ruch, in the care and management of that house with your mother do you ever find it necessary at times to carry with you what you have denominated upon various occasions as a little protector?
MR. McINTYRE: Objected to. There is no evidence here that he ever did.
Q. Did you ever make a statement to anybody that you sometimes had trouble with your tenants but you always got along very well because you carried with you a little protector?
MR. McINTYRE: That is objected to as immaterial.
THE COURT: I do not see how that affects this case at all.
Q. What time was it that you got into this saloon on this Sunday afternoon? A. About half past three.
Q. Now, who was behind the bar as near as you can remember when you went in? A. The other bar tender.
Q. That was McCabe?
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A. I don't know his name sir.
Q. You went in with Mr. O'Keefe, did you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You had a drink when you first went in? A. I did.
Q. Did you have a drink after that? A. We did.
Q. Who served you the second drink? A. Donnelly.
Q. Now, at the time that you got the first drink, how many people besides yourself, O'Keefe and the other bartender do you recall as being in the saloon?
A. Only Collins. Q. Only Collins? A. That is all.
Q. Did you know Collins at that time? A. No, sir.
Q. You became acquainted with him after the shooting? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You and he have met upon a number of occasions since the shooting, have you not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you have had drinks with him?
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A. I have.
Q. Do you recollect that some time last fall you met him down in the Oak saloon at 23rd, Street and Eighth
Avenue?
A. In the Oak?
Q. You know where it is.
A. I don't remember the name.
Q. You know the saloon down in the basement? A.
A basement?
A. Yes, the shop is down in the basement and the bar is off the street. A. And level with the walk?
A. Yes, level with the walk. A. Yes, sir.
Q. It is known as the Oak?
A. I don't remember the name of it. That is a neighborhood I am not very frequently in.
Q. Do you recollect being in there say in the middle of August last year with another party when you met
Collins there? A. Yes, I do.
Q. Was that the time that you asked Collins if he had
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seen a little fellow who represented himself as coming from the Herald? Objected to.
Q. Did you ask him that? A. No, sir.
Q. Did Collins ask you if you had seen the little fellow? A. Not that I remember of.
Q. And then did you reply to Collins, "Well, if the monkey had been around to see Kiernan--- MR McINTYRE: That is objected to.
THE COURT: It is not a logical question to ask him.
MR McINTYRE: Collins denies that any such meeting took place. He is concluded by Collin's answer, anyway. THE COURT: No. (To the witness.) On any occasion when you were there with Collins did you hear any talk about
a little fellow or a monkey from the Herald office spoken of?
A. I do remember, now. There was man came to the house one day and he said he was from the Herald. Q. Do you remember speaking with Collins in reference to a conversation of that kind?
A. I don't remember mentioning that to Collins.
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BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Do you remember that you said, "He came to see me but I was on to him?" Objected to.
Q. And then did Collins or anybody else while you were in the Oak saloon say, "I have heard of the bloke and he has been to see Davis and Kiernan but he has not been to see me?"
Same objection.
THE COURT: Strike out "and then," and then read the question. Q. (Read.)
A. No, I did not.
Q. How long do you think you were in that saloon, Mr. Ruch, before Donnelly came in? A. Only about ten minutes.
Q. Can you now fix about the time that you entered the saloon? A. Not exactly. As near as I can tell, it was half past three.
Q. Half past three? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You think you had been in there at least ten minutes before Donnelly came in? A. About that.
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Q. Had you been in there much longer than ten minutes, as near as you now recollect? A. Not before Donnelly came in.
Q. How long after Donnelly came in was it before you heard the pistol shot? A. Well, in all, it was about twenty minutes.
Q. You don't recollect where he got the pistol from, do you? A. No.
Q. You did not see him at the time that he had the pistol? A. I did not.
Q. And you did not see him at the time that he aimed it at Madden? A. No, sir.
Q. The first thing that you knew of a pistol being in the hands of anybody was when you heard the shot? A. That is all.
Q. And then you say you turned around and saw the defendant was putting the pistol back into the drawer? A. That is right.
Q. How long before the officer came had you and O'Keefe
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started to go out?
A. We were there at the side door. We didn't move through it. We didn't have a chance. Q. You didn't have time, did you?
A. The officer was in too quick.
Q. So that when the officer came in neither you nor Donnelly had made any effort to go out of the saloon? A. No, sir.
Q. When the officer came in did he ask you to throw up your hands?
A. He didn't ask me. I had my hat off and it was lying on the lunch counter. Q. Was your coat off?
A. No, sir.
Q. Just your hat---that is all? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you remember before that that you and O'Keefe have started to measure yourselves to see which was the tallest of the two?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. When the officer came in? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What did the officer say to you when he came in?
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A. He asked me if I done the shooting. Q. What did you say?
A. I said, "No."
Q. Did he search you?
A. No, sir. I don't remember it.
Q. Don't you remember he told you to open your pockets?
A. He put his hands on to me and he asked me if I done the shooting and I said no. Q. What next did the officer do?
A. He asked O'Keefe and he asked Collins.
Q. All three of you denied doing the shooting? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Neither one of you told the officer who did it? A. No.
Q. What did the officer say to Donnelly? If anything? A. He asked Donnelly if he done it and he said, "Yes."
Q. Donnelly didn't appear to hesitate to tell the officer the truth? A. Not that I saw.
Q. Mr. Ruch, upon that night in August, 1893 when you met Collins in the Oak saloon at 23rd. Street and Eighth
Avenue did you know who that other party was that was with you?
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A. I did not know his name. I got acquainted with him. He was a man from the neighborhood where I lived. We get acquainted with him some way.
Q. You scraped an acquaintance with him? A. That is all.
Q. Do you know whether or not after Bob Cawfield was discharged that this fellow that you scraped an acquaintance with was a laborer with Collins?
Objected to. Question not pressed. Q. Do you know Bob Cawfield?
A. No, sir.
Q. Do you know whether this fellow that you scraped an acquaintance with and who was with you in the Oak saloon on the night that you met Collins had ever worked on the ice wagon with Collins?
A. I had heard it remarked that he was on it for a while. Q. He used to come up to your house?
A. He used---he was not in my house. I met him outside of the house. Q. Did you ever go to the theatre with him?
A. I did.
Q. How many times? A. I went twice.
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Q. Do you recollect that after the second visit that you two had been to the theatre that you were going up Eighth Avenue and he asked you to go in to Donnelly's to have a drink and you said you did not want to go in there?
A. I don't recollect.
Q. Do you say that such a thing never occurred? THE COURT: Oh, no. He doesn't recollect it.
Q.
A little while after that shooting were afflicted with an abscess in your groin? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You never told me that before, did you? A. No, sir.
MR McINTYRE: You have not been handling the peoples witnesses before this, have you? MR. HOUSE: No.
Q. Now, bearing in mind if you can this party that you scraped an acquaintance with, see if you can recall that one night after you had been to the theatre with him and some little time after the shooting that you two went up Eighth Avenue and you did go into Donnelly's saloon and have a drink?
No answer.
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BY THE COURT:
Q. You know the man you went to the theatre with? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You went there on two occasions? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you go into Donnelly's saloon with that man and have a drink? A. I don't recollect.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Can you recollect that when you started to go in the front door you saw Mr. Felix Donnelly sitting in a chair outside and you said, "Don't let us go in this door?"
A. I can't remember that. Q. Can you remember it?
A. I don't believe it ever happened.
Q. You don't believe it ever happened? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you ever say to any person in your life after the shooting and before the haring before the Coroner
that you and Collins and the rest of you had stood back expecting that Donnelly would offer you some money, that it was his chance to have done so then and that you could
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have made a statement which would have helped him out but that they did not come to see you and it was too late now?
BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you ever make any such statement to anyone? A. No, sir; I don't believe---
Q. Did you? A. No, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. You swear positively you never made any such statement to anyone? A. No, sir; I don't believe---
Q. Did you? A. No, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. You swear positively you never made any such statement? A. I don't recollect making it at all.
Q. Do you recollect having an uncle who was killed in a fight on Seventh Avenue by an Italian at one time? Objected to.
A. I do.
Q. Do you recollect that in a conversation in Donnelly's saloon one night with this man that you said the
Italian had made his defense on the ground on the ground of self defense? Objected to.
A. If he made it?
Q. That the Italian's defense was self defense and that there was one witness for the Italian who was a woman.
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Do you recollect that?
A. There was a woman. BY THE COURT:
Q. You heard what the counsel said? A. Yes, sir.
Q. About the Italian? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Do you recollect making a statement that the defense that was put in for him, for the Italian, was that of self defense?
A. No, sir.
Q. And the only witness there was a woman who testified that the Italian had done it in self defense?
A. No, sir. The woman was all right but I don't remember saying anything about self defense---not that I
remember of.
Q. Now, do you recollect that on the night that you did make the statement about your uncle being killed and saying that there was a woman in the case---
THE COURT: He did not say there was a woman in the case.
THE WITNESS: Not in the case. I said there was a woman but I did not say there was a woman in the case. Q. Did she testify to your knowledge?
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A. I don't know anything about it. I was not there.
Q. We have got the fact of your uncle having been killed by an Italian? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And there was a woman and whether she testified in the case you don't know? A. No, sir.
Q. Having got these facts, let me put the question over to you again on your oath. After having had the conversation about your uncle and the Italian and the woman, did you say to the person whom you went with to the theatre that night that you had hung back expecting that the Donnellys would offer some money and that if they had offered some money before the first hearing that your statement could have made a difference but that now having made one statement it was too late to make another?
BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you make any such statement? A. No sir; I did not.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. This person that has been referred as having gone to the theatre with you, you can not recall? A. I forget his name.
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Q. Do you know whether he was seen by the other side? A. I could not say.
Q. Have you been approached in this case by the other side? A. No, sir.
ALBERT F. WESTON M.D., a witness called on behalf of the people, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You are a physician? A. Yes, sir.
A. Yes. sir.
Q. You were a physician on the 28th day of May last year? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What official position did you hold at that time?
A. One of the Coroner's physicians of the City of New York.
Q. Did you make an autopsy on the body of Charles Madden? A. A. I did.
Q. At that place?
A. At Roosevelt Hospital.
Q. What time, if you remembered?
A. On the morning of the 10th of June.
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Q. Will you state from the examination made on that autopsy and from your observation what you saw? A. I found on external examination of the body a small line would just below the point of the breast bone
and's little to the left of the middle line of the body.
THE COURT: Went you stand up and indicate on your own body where the wound was?
A. It was about that point---about an inch to the left of the medium line of the body. The wound had almost entirely healed. On the left forearm there were two small wounds in the fleshy portion of the forearm, almost completely healed; upon opening the body there was found a track of a bullet from this would in the body passing backward and to the right. It passed through the liver, through the diaphragm `and into the right lung where the bullet was found. There was an abscess of the liver along the track of the bullet and the pleural cavity contained a large quantity of exudation, the cavity contained a large quantity of exudation, the result
of an inflammatory process.
BY THE COURT: Q. Caused by what?
A. Caused by the bullet wound. The other organs of the body were in a healthy condition. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. In your opinion, what was the
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cause of death?
A. The cause of death was the result of pleuriay and abscess of the liver resulting from a pistol shot wound. Q. Now, you spoke about these two wounds on the fore-arm. On which arm were they?
A. The left fore-arm.
Q. Just about where---what point? A. Just by the wrist. (Indicating.) BY THE COURT:
Q. How far did those wounds extend? Did they extend along the arm?
A. They seemed to be one opposite the other---one on the outside and one on the inside of the fore-arm. They were apparently in a line with one another.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. And apparently made by the shot? A. Apparently made by the shot.
Q. Did you find the bullet Doctor?
A. I did. The bullet was in the right lung.
MR. McINTYRE: We offer the bullet in evidence. (Producing same.) THE WITNESS: The bullet was a 38 calibre.
THE COURT: Put it in an envelope and let it be marked People's Exhibit 2. (Envelope containing bullet marked People's Exhibit
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2, February 27, 1894.)
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. At the time you performed the autopsy, did you find the rest of the organs in fairly good condition? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What was the appearance of the body, Doctor, so far as the indication being that it was that of a fairly strong muscular man in life---did it show that?
A. It did, it seemed to me.
Q. You say that the wound that entered the body was where?
A.
A little to the left of the median line---about that point. (Indicating.) Q. Would that be about the breast bone?
A. It was just about one inch to the left of the point of the breast bone. Q. Just about one inch to the left of the point of the breast bone?
A. Yes, sir.
PATRICK J. KIERNAN, a witness called on behalf of the people being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. MARTINE:
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THE COURT: Is there any question that the body that the Doctor made the autopsy on was the body of the deceased?
MR. HOUSE: We have no evidence to the contrary. There is no doubt but what it was the body of the deceased. Q. Where do you reside?
A. I reside at 231 West 35th. Street. Q. What is your business?
A. Well, it was up to the 12th day of last January running a freight elevator in a silk house at 469 Broome
Street.
Q. For whom?
A.
A For William Shroeder & Company. Q. What business are you now in?
A. I aint doing anything now, sir.
Q. Were you acquainted with Charles Madden during his lifetime? A. Yes, I was.
Q. And the defendant James Donnelly? A. I was for a short time.
Q. Do you know the saloon on the northeast corner of 28th Street and Eighth Avenue in this City?
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A. I do sir.
Q. By whom was it kept?
A. By a man named Felix Donnelly.
Q. Did Donnelly, the defendant, occupy any position in that saloon? A. I believed he occupied the position of bartender.
Q. Do you know of any disagreement between the defendant Donnelly and the deceased Madden? A. No, I don't.
Q. Did you ever hear any threats made by the defendant? MR. HOUSE: That is objected to.
THE COURT: Not in that shape.
Q. In the neighborhood of the middle of April did you hear the defendant Donnelly say anything against the deceased Madden?
MR. HOUSE: I object to the question.
THE COURT: He has a right to put the question in another way. Q. How long have you known this defendant?
A. About two years, sir.
Q. Did you ever hear any conversation or did you have any conversation with the defendant or were you present at any conversation between the defendant and anybody
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else when the dead man's name was brought out? A. I was.
Q. When was it and where was it?
A. Well, about six weeks previous to the time Madden was shot I heard James Donnelly--- MR. HOUSE: Not what you heard.
Q. Did you hear Donnelly say it? A. I did.
Q. The defendant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You heard Donnelly say what?
A. That he would shoot that cock-eyed son of a bitch on sight. Q. Where was that said?
A. Right in Felix Donnelly's saloon on Eighth Avenue and 28th Street. Q. Were you in the saloon?
A. I was.
Q. What was it that led up to the conversation? A. Well, I could not exactly say.
Q. What door did you start to enter the saloon by? A. The front door on the Eighth Avenue side.
Q. Did anyone pass you as you entered?
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A. He went under the door. Q. Who did?
A. Madden. Madden came out from the saloon under the screen dors. Q. Did you look into the saloon?
A. I did.
Q. Who did you see there?
A. I seen James Donnelly with a pistol in his hand. Q. The defendant?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. With a pistol in his hand? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Which way was he pointing it?
A. He had it down toward the bottom of the bar like. Q. What did you do then?
A. As soon as I seen the pistol, of course, I wasn't going to go in there and I went around into the side door.
Q. Into the saloon? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What did you see then?
A. We had two glasses of beer. James Donnelly said then he "Would shoot that cock-eyed son of a bitch on sight"
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We had our beer and walked out. BY THE COURT:
Q. Who was with you at that time? A. Charles Davis was with me.
BY MR. MARTINE:
Q. Did you see Madden afterward that evening? A. Only just outside, that is all---on the walk.
Q. Did you have any conversation with him?
A. I asked him what was the trouble and he said he didn't know, he didn't do anything. BY THE COURT:
Q. Who said this?
MR. MARTINE: The deceased, Madden.
THE COURT: That wont do. Strike that out. That wont do unless the defendant was actually present. BY MR. MARTINE:
Q. What sort of doors were there at the front of the saloon? A. Rattan swinging doors.
Q. Which door did Madden go out of? A. Out of the rattan swinging doors.
Q. On which side?
A. Going out of the saloon it was on the right side or the left side going in. Q. How did he go out of the saloon?
A. He came down on his hands and knees.
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Q. He crawled underneath? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you look into the door and see Donnelly with the pistol in his hand? A. I did, sir.
Q. When Madden had just gone out and you looked into the saloon and saw Donnelly with the pistol in his hands, did he say anything?
A. No sir; because we did not wait to hear him say anything. Q. You went around and entered through the side door? Objected to by Mr. House as leading and improper.
THE COURT: He has already testified to it. A. Yes, I entered on the 28th. Street side. Q. You took a drink?
A. Yes, I took a drink.
Q. When was it that he said that he would shoot---
A. To the best of my recollection about five or six weeks previous to the shooting. Q. I mean, upon this occasion---at this time?
A. That night---a little after, yes.
Q. When you went around and went in to the side door was it then?
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A. No, sir; when we were up to the bar and had our beer. Q. Did he still have the pistol in his hand?
A. No, sir. He had it in his hand before we got to the bar and then he came and served us and then made that threat.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE: Q. How are old are you Mr. Kiernan?
A. I will be 22 the 18th day of March. Q. Have you ever been arrested?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Whereabouts did you live on the 28th day of May, 1893. A. 226 West 27th Street.
Q. Was that in the same house where Madden lived? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you ever live in the same house with Madden? A. I did, sir.
Q. How long ago was it that you lived in the same house with Madden? A. Madden resided there after I left but we were there
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about three years.
Q. You and Madden were warm personal friends? A. Pretty friendly.
Q. You were a warm personal friend of Davis who was with you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And he was likewise a warm personal friend of Madden's? A. I could not say.
Q. For how many years had you and Madden been warm personal friends? A. For about seventeen years.
Q. You have been out together frequently? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And have drunk together frequently? A. Once in a white, sir.
Q. Well, more than one is a while?
A. I could not say. I say once in a while.
Q. But I am saying more than once in a while. A. No, only when we would meet.
Q. You met quite frequency? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now you were a witness before the Coroner, were you not?
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A. I was, sir.
Q. You were sworn before you gave your evidence, were you not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Sworn under oath to tell the truth? A. Yes, sir.
THE COURT: He could not have been sworn in any other way.
Q. Now, do you recollect this question being put to you? "Where was Madden after going in under the screen doors?" Do you recollect that question?
A. Coming out of the screen door, yes.
Q. (Read.) "Q. What door? A. The screen door. When he saw the pistol he ran into the street. We went to the side door and Donnelly still had the pistol in his hand and said, I will kill him on sight---
A. He would shoot that cock-eyed son of a bitch on sight. Q. Did you say that before the Coroner?
A. I did, yes.
Q. If it does not appear on the stenographer's minutes the stenographer has misquoted your testimony at the
Coroner's inquest?
THE COURT: You need not answer.
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MR. HOUSE: Will your Honor give me the benefit of an exception? THE COURT: Yes.
Q. I ask you, sir, on your oath, did you say a word at the Coroner's inquest about the cock-eyed son of a bitch?
A. I did, yes. Q. You did?
A. I did; yes sir.
Q. You say this was about six weeks before the shooting Mr. Kiernan? A. Five or six weeks---about that.
Q. Where had you and Davis been that night? A. Up to 31st. Street and Eighth Avenue.
Q. Whereabouts in 31st. Street?
A. I was up to Davis's house and I met Davis at the house and we came along then Eighth Avenue and had a drink---
Q. At whose place?
A.
A corner place, Clark's I believe it is. Q. How many drinks did you have there? A. One drink.
Q. What was it? A. Larger beer.
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Q. And then you started to go down where?
A. Down to 28th Street. We walked down to that corner. Q. Why that corner in preference to any other?
A. Only we used to stand upon that corner and I said, "Come in Charley and have a glass of beer." Q. Whose place were you going in then?
A. Donnelly's.
Q. How did you go into that saloon? A. In the front way.
Q. When you got to the front door what did you see?
A. As I opened the door on that side Madden came from under right past me. Q. Whereabouts was Donnelly?
A. Donnelly was standing right behind the cigar lighter. Q. Behind the counter?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Behind the bar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did he have the pistol in his hand? A. He did.
Q. Did he try to shoot it off as you could see? THE COURT: Oh, no.
Question not pressed.
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Q. Was the pistol fired off?
A. No, sir; it was not, as I seen.
Q. If that pistol had been fired, wouldn't you have heard the report? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You say that Donnelly stood behind the bar with the pistol in his hand? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was there anything to prevent him at the time you came in from firing it, as far as you could see? A. No, except his courage or that it wasn't loaded.
Q. Or it wasn't loaded? With the exception of the lack of courage and the possibility that the pistol might not have been loaded, there was nothing to prevent him from firing it?
A. No sir, as far as I could see.
Q. You say he did not fire that pistol? A. No.
Q. Did you see him attempt to fire it? A. He held it up in his hand.
Q. I say, did you see him attempt to fire it?
THE COURT: "He says he held it up in his hand." That is his answer.
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MR. HOUSE. Give me an exception please.
Q. Did you see Madden afterward, after you came into the store? A. Not immediately after.
Q. Did you see him that night? A. I did.
Q. Did Madden ask you to go to the Police Station that night? A. Not that night.
Q. Did you go to the Police Station that night? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you ever go to the Police Station with Madden when he had complained---when he made a complaint because of this upon him by this defendant?
A. Never.
Q. Do you know whether Madden ever went to make a complaint or not? A. That I can not say.
Q. But you know you never were with him? A. No.
Q. How many times have you talked over this subject with Davis since it happened? A. Only once in a while---
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Q. You and Davis have talked it over frequently?
A. Once in a while we have had a little conversation.
Q. I mean about your going in and seeing the defendant with the pistol? A. I did not mention that.
Q. You didn't talk about that?
A. No, I did not have anything to say at all about that.
Q. From the time, five or six weeks before the shooting, down to this present time, haven't you talked that occurrence over at all?
A. No sir, not at all.
Q. And have never compared notes in regard to it at all? A. No, sir.
Q. And never have spoken to one another about what you were going to testify to? A. No, sir.
Q. Now, you say, Madden was coming from under the swinging door and you went in to the saloon and saw Donnelly with the pistol and he said he would shoot the cock-eyed son of a bitch on sight?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where did you go then?
A. We had a drink of beer and went out.
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Q. Where to?
A. To Miner's Theatre.
Q. Madden went out into the Street? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You did not follow him out to see where he went to? A. No, sir.
Q. Or to see whether he had been injured? A. We remained and went around---
Q. And went around into the side door? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And got your drink? A. And got our drink.
Q. What did Donnelly do with the pistol?
A. I remember then he put it into the drawer.
Q. He didn't come around from behind the bar and go out into the street to see what became of Madden? A. No, sir.
Q. So far as you know, he might have followed Madden out into the street? A. No sir; I didn't see him.
Q. You say that you did not know that there was any cause of a quarrel between him and this defendant? A. No, I did not.
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Q. You have been in that saloon on more than one occasion have you? A. I have, sir.
Q. Do you know a colored fellow by the name of Johnson? A. I do, sir.
Q. Were you present in the saloon one night when Johnson was there and Madden was there and this defendant was there?
A. Well, I was, one night.
Q. There was some young men that came in there who began shaking dice, didn't they? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Donnelly was behind the bar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. There was something said in Donnelly's presence about the loss of an umbrella? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And Madden took up a glass of beer from the bar and struck Johnson over the head with it and out his face with it?
A. He done it for cause. Q. But he did it?
A. He did.
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Q. Did you go with Johnson, the colored man, around to the station house? A. I went over to the drug store and they refused us admittance there.
Q. And then where did you go?
A. I took him up and left him at the 37th. Street Station. Q. Did you see Johnson that night afterward?
A. No.
Q. Did you learn whether he went to the hospital and had his face sewed up? A. He told us afterwards he did.
Q. Now, at the time that Johnson and this stranger had had some talk about an umbrella did Madden say to
Johnson "I will let no nigger son of a bitch call a white friend of mine down?" A. No, sir.
Q. What caused him to strike that man and cut his face open, if you know?
A. This fellow came into the saloon. He is a pretty good spender and he came in to throw dice and he had a silk umbrella in his hand and he put it up against the bar and it was missed in a little while and Madden was
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standing there with a glass of beer in his hand and Johnson said he didn't take the umbrella as somebody had accused him of. He said he didn't take the umbrella. Madden turned and said, "One of you fellows took it," pointing around to the bar, to Johnson. Johnson said, "You are a white son of a bitch." Madden said, "Don't
call me a son of a bitch", and with that Madden threw the glass and hit him. Q. Did you see Johnson pull out a knife?
A. I seen him pull out a pen-knife. Q. Was the pen-knife open?
A. No, sir.
Q. Did he strike at Madden?
A. He made a lunge and went over toward Madden and Madden fired a glass at him then and hit him. Q. And cut his face open?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Were you present when Madden kicked Tucker, the colored fellow? Objected to as assuming that he did do it.
Question withdrawn.
Q. You went to the drug store with the colored man Johnson, did you? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. Where did Madden go?
A. I don't know where Madden went.
Q. Madden didn't go with the colored fellow? A. No.
THE COURT: The witness said that he went with this colored man to the drug store and they wouldn't admit him and then he was taken to the hospital.
THE WITNESS: No, sir. I took him up to the 37th Street Station House.
Q. Now, don't you recollect that the occurrence which you were talking about, of Madden and Donnelly, and Donnelly saying that he would shoot the cock-eyed son of a bitch on sight, that you tried to get Madden to go out of that place that night?
A. No, sir.
Q. And that Madden said that he would not leave that place? A. No sir, I don't.
Q. And that you said, that you were not the man to stay here and see anybody killed? A. No sir; I didn't hear anything like that and I wasn't there at that time.
Q. You have no knowledge as to what was the difficulty
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between Madden and Donnelly before you went into the place? A. Not the slightest.
RE-DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. MARTINE:
Q. Have you testified now to all that you remember? A. I have as far as I can.
Q. Have you exhausted your memory? A. No sir; I have not.
Q. I mean concerning what occurred at that time? THE COURT: At what time?
MR. MARTINE: I am speaking of the night that he went to this saloon when Donnelly was pointing the pistol at the door out of which he had gone.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Have you stated al that you now recollect with reference to what took place on the night that you saw the deceased come under the door?
A. I have said all that I recollect about it, yes. BY MR. MARTINE:
Q. You have told me and you have also tome Mr. House that Madden ran out under the right door? A. Coming out of the saloon.
Q. And you were going in on his left? A. On his left.
Q. You saw Donnelly pointing the pistol in the direction
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of the door? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you hear Donnelly say anything at that time? A. No sir; I did not.
Q. Did you hear him say this, "I thought he stood in under the bar and I was waiting to shoot him?" A. That is what he said, yes, after we went inside.
Q. "I thought he stopped in under the bar and I was waiting to shoot him?" A. That is right.
Q. Now, coming down to the time of the fight between Madden and the negro Johnson, did the negro Johnson make any attempt to open a knife?
A. Not as I seen.
THE COURT: He has told you all he knows about that.
CHARLES DAVIS, a witness called on behalf of the People, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. MARTINE:
Q. Where do you reside Mr. Davis? A. 327 West 29th Street.
Q. What is your business?
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A. Painter.
Q. Do you know the saloon on the corner of 28th Street and Eighth Avenue in this City? A. Yes, sir.
Q. By whom is it occupied? A. By Felix Donnelly.
Q. Do you know the defendant at the Bar, James Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you know Charles Madden in his lifetime? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know whether Donnelly in May last occupied any place in the saloon of Felix Donnelly? A. Did Mr. Donnelly keep any place?
BY THE COURT:
Q. Did he work in there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Doing what? A. Bartender.
BY MR. MARTINE:
Q. Do you know Patrick Kiernan? A. Yes, sir.
Q. (By the Court.) Do you recollect the shooting? A. No, sir; I wasn't there.
Q. You heard of it? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. You recollect about the time the shooting took place?
A. It took place in the afternoon about three or four o'clock. BY MR. MARTINE:
Q. Now, were you present at any conversation where anything was said by the defendant with reference to this deceased man?
A. About six weeks before that I was going in the front door---
MR. HOUSE: I wish to object to the question on the ground that it is irrelevant, immaterial and incompetent. THE COURT: I suppose the object is to show threats.
Q. You were present at such a conversation? Exception by defendant.
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What was it the defendant said?
A. He said he would shoot Mr. Madden on sight. Q. Whom were you in company with, if any one? A. Myself---not with anybody.
Q. I mean in the early part of the evening, where were you? A. I was walking up the Avenue.
Q. I mean when you started out after dinner?
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A. I went to Donnelly's saloon. Q. In company with whom?
A. Myself.
Q. (By the Court.) Did you meet anybody in Donnelly's saloon that you knew? A. There was a couple of young men in there.
BY MR. MARTINE:
Q. Was Kiernan there?
A. No sir; not at that time. Q. Was Madden there?
A. No, sir.
Q. Did you sign that statement, Mr. Davis? (Showing paper to witness.) A. Yes, sir.
Q. You have read that statement of Mr. Kiernan's, have you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. When you went into Donnelly's saloon what door did you start to enter?
MR. HOUSE: One moment, if your Honor please. That is objected to. They are trying to get a threat. Does it make any difference whether he went into the front door or not?
THE COURT: It may.
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MR. HOUSE: I will take the benefit of an exception. Q. (Repeated.)
A. The front door.
Q. Did you see anyone then?
A. Not at the time of this remark. Q. When was it?
A. It was about six weeks previous. Q. Who were you with?
A. With Mr. Kiernan. Mr. Madden came out underneath the door as we were going in and Mr. Donnelly held a revolver in his hand.
Q. Where was he?
A. Behind the bar. We went around to the side door and came in and he says, "I will shoot the cock-eyed son of a bitch." We had a glass of beer and walked out.
Q. Was there any conversation concerning Madden?
A. He told me he didn't know that he would shoot or not. I said it would be a foolish thing to do. He said he would be justified in doing it.
Q. When was that?
A. Some time after he and Madden had that little dispute. Q. After the first time?
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A. Yes, sir.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Of course, when he told you this that he would shoot Madden on sight you went right around and told Madden that?
A. No, sir.
Q. You did not? A. No, sir.
Q. How long had you known Mr. Madden, Mr. Davis? A. Well, five or six years.
Q. You were quite friendly with Mr. Madden? A. Yes, I was quite friendly with Mr. Madden. Q. You met him very frequently, did you not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And drank with him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And went to places of amusement with him? A. Sometimes.
Q. And you were very frequently in his company? A. Yes, of an evening.
Q. You say that this night when you were in the saloon Donnelly said to you, "I will shoot Madden on sight," and you told him it was very foolish if he would do that?
A. Yes, sir.
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Q. You never went and told your friend, however, that Donnelly said he was going to shoot him on a sight? A. No, sir.
Q. Where had you and O'Keefe been on the night when you went into the saloon and saw Donnelly with the pistol in his hand?
A. I was not with O'Keefe.
Q. You were with Kiernan then? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where had you and Kiernan been that night before you went into Donnelly's place? A. Coming down 31st. Street.
Q. Who was in Donnelly's saloon when you went in there? A. I could not name the men that was in there.
Q. There was quite number of them? A. Two or three men?
Q. In the saloon? A. Yes, sir.
Q. That was the time that Madden was coming out when Donnelly had the pistol in his hand? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Didn't you know those two or three people that were in the saloon?
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A. I didn't pay any attention. I wanted to get out of the saloon when I saw him with his pistol in his hand. Q. How do you say Madden was coming out of the saloon that night?
A. Underneath the doors. Q. Donnelly was where?
A. Over the bar with a revolver in his hand. Q. The revolver went off, didn't it?
A. No, sir.
Q. Are you sure?
A. No sir; it didn't go off.
Q. Didn't Donnelly make any attempt to fire the pistol off? A. He did not.
Q. Then after your friend Madden ran out of the saloon Donnelly went from behind the bar and followed out to see where he was?
A. No, sir.
Q. Didn't he go out at all? A. No, sir.
Q. He did not attempt to follow him out? A. No, sir.
Q. You went out to see if any injury had been inflicted
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upon your friend Madden? A. No, sir.
Q. You saw Madden that night? A. No, sir.
Q. You saw him the next morning? A. No, sir.
Q. Didn't Madden come down to your house the next morning and ask you to go to the Police Court to make a complaint against Donnelly?
A. No, sir.
Q. Didn't Madden ever ask you to go with him to the Police Court and testify that you had heard Donnelly say anything of that kind?
A. No.
Q. Do you know whether Madden ever made a complaint or not? A. No, sir.
Q. What became of all these other people that were in the saloon that night? A. I don't know.
Q. Did they run out the same as you did?
A. I don't know whether they did or not. I looked out for myself.
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Q. And you came right out after that---
A. Madden was going out as I was going in.
Q. Then you went around to the side door. Did you go into the saloon? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then you got over being frightened? A. Yes, sir.
Q. From the front door around to the side door, your people had all disappeared? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What did you go in there for? A. Curiosity.
Q. For curiosity? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What curiosity led you to enter there after you were frightened out of the place? A. To find out what it was about.
Q. Did you find out what it was about? A. No, sir.
Q. Then your curiosity was not satisfied? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you have anything to drink after you went around there?
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A. I had a glass of beer.
Q. Were these other people in the saloon then? A. No, sir.
Q. They had gone out? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you see which way they went out? A. No sir; I didn't.
Q. Donnelly told you all about what it was? A. No, sir.
Q. Never said a word to you about it? A. No, sir.
Q. He just put his pistol up? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You called for a drink? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And got it? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, it was when Madden was going under the screen door and you and Patrick Kiernan were going in that
Donnelly said, "I will shoot the cock-eyed son of a bitch? A. When we went around to the side door.
Q. Did you ask what the trouble was about?
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A. No, sir.
Q. You didn't say a word to him at all? A. No, sir.
Q. When you came around and asked for a glass of beer he volunteered the statement to you that he would shoot the cock-eyed son of a bitch on sight?
A. That is it.
Q. Did he say that before or after he got the beer for you? A. Before.
Q. You said nothing to him to cause him to make that remark? A. No, sir.
Q. And Patrick Kiernan didn't? A. Not to my knowledge.
Q. You were in Kiernan's company? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And being in Kiernan's company if he had said anything you would have heard it? A. Most like I would.
Q. Didn't he say he was going out that night to look after him, to kill him? A. Who?
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Q. Donnelly? A. No, sir.
Q. He didn't say that? A. No, sir.
Q. What did you do after you got that glass of beer? A. Went out.
Q. Where?
A. Went around the corner---down to Miner's---some place of amusement. Q. You did not go out to find Madden?
A. No, sir.
Q. Madden and you had been personal friends for several years? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You went into the front door of that saloon and saw Madden coming out under the swinging doors? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You say Donnelly was behind the bar with a revolver in his hand? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You were frightened and ran? A. Yes, sir.
BY THE FOREMAN OF THE JURY: Q. In what shape was Madden
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in when he was coming out?
A. He was crawling underneath. BY THE COURT:
Q. Underneath the swinging doors? A. Yes, sir.
Q. They did not go right down to the ground? A. No, sir.
Q. As you were going in at the left hand door this man was coming out underneath the door? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And instead of going in the front door you turned and went around and went in the side door and then had the conversation with this defendant?
A. Yes, sir.
BY THE EIGHTH JUROR:
Q. Do you know the cause of his going out that way? A. Yes, the defendant was pointing his pistol at him.
THE COURT: That is his idea only. They were about entering and they found the deceased crawling out under the right side of that door. According to his testimony the defendant was standing behind the bar with the pistol
in his hand and then this man and his friend, instead of going in the front door, went around and went into the side door and had a conversation with the defendant.
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BY THE FOURTH JUROR:
Q. How far into the door did they go when they saw him coming out? BY THE COURT:
Q. How far were you inside the swinging doors?
A. I didn't go in at all---just opened the door and Madden was coming out. BY THE FOURTH JUROR:
Q. You had opened the swinging doors? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. They were light bamboo doors?
A. I don't know that they were. They were solid doors of wood. I don't know what. They were not made out of bamboo.
BY THE FOURTH JUROR:
Q. You had actually partly entered this swinging door when he crawled through? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then you could see what was going on inside? A. Yes, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q. As I understand it, he was on his hands and knees? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Coming right out? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. And having seen that and the defendant behind the bar you went around to the side door? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And paid no more attention to Madden? A. No, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE: Did you converse with Madden after that regarding that transaction? Question withdrawn.
ARNOLD H. KNAPP, M. D., a witness called on behalf of the people, having duly affirmed, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. What is your profession? A. Medicine.
Q. Were you physician on or about the 28th day of May last? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Connected with what public institution? A. Roosevelt Hospital.
Q. Tell us what your hospital duties were at the time? A. I was the third man on the surgical staff.
Q. And associated with Dr. Cox?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you remember when Charles Madden was brought to the hospital which you have referred to? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What time was he brought there? A. What time of day?
Q. No, the date? A. 28th of May.
Q. On the evening of that day? A. I don't remember.
Q. Do you remember making an examination of his body in conjunction with Dr. Cox? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, will you state from your examination then made what you saw?
A. There was a small round hole in the skin directly below the breast bone or the sternum which led into a track which traced backwards and to the right.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Let the Jury know. They don't know as much as you and I do about the sternum. Get up and point out on your body where it was.
A. This is about the lower part of the sternum---a little to the left---and the direction of the track seemed to be
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backwards towards the right.
Q. Was there any wound upon the arm? A. There was a slight wound.
Q. On which arm?
A. The left fore-arm. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. How long was Madden in the hospital under treatment? A. Until the 9th of June.
Q. On that day what occurred? A. He died.
Q. You were present when the autopsy was held? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And the autopsy that was held by Dr. Weston was upon the person who was received on the 28th day of May? A. Yes, sir.
No cross-examination.
EDWARD O'NEILL, a witness called on behalf of the people, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You are a police officer? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Were you connected with the Police Department of the
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city of New York on or about the 28th day of May last? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What precinct? A. 20th precinct.
Q. Were you connected with that precinct on the 28th day of May last? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What was your best at that time?
A. From the north side of 27th Street to the south side of 31st. Street.
Q. On the afternoon of the 28th day of May, 1893 were you doing police duty in that vicinity? A. Yes, sir.
Q. In the block bounded by 28th and 27th Streets? A. Yes, sir.
Q. On the afternoon of that day did anything attract your attention? A. Yes, on or about four o'clock.
Q. And in consequence of what attracted your attention where did you go, what did you do and whom did you see?
A. I heard a pistol shot. Q. In what place?
A. I was standing on the corner of 28th Street and
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Eighth Avenue.
Q. Who fired the pistol?
A. I did not know. Then I seen Charles Madden reel and fall on the sidewalk. Q. In front of whose place?
A. On the side entrance of Donnelly's. Q. Of Donnelly's store?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What time was that?
A. About four o'clock---on or about. Q. What did you do then?
A. I seen the man reel and fall with his hands this way. I could not say whether it was his left hand or not
and I seen the blood and I sent a citizen and I told him to go and get an ambulance at once and I sent another citizen for an officer.
Q. And the ambulance came?
A. Yes. I went into the store and there was Ruch, O'Keefe and Collins in there. Ruch had his hat off and I
thought he was the man that done the shooting so I made him put his hands up. Q. You found nothing on his body?
A. I asked who done the shooting and all denied the
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shooting and then I asked Donnelly and he said he done it. Q. Where was he when you asked who did the shooting?
A. Behind the bar.
Q. Is that all that he said, that he did the shooting?
A. I asked him for the pistol and he went to the drawer and picked the pistol out and gave it to me.
Q. Let me ask you to look at this diagram. That represents Eighth Avenue. This represents the bar in that place. Will you indicate which drawer he took the pistol out of?
A. The centre drawer. I don't know how many drawers there were---around the centre of the drawers. Q. He took the pistol out and gave it to you?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Will you look at the pistol now handed you and state whether that is the pistol that he gave to you upon that occasion?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, did you examine the barrel of this revolver? A. I did, yes.
Q. Did you notice how many shells had been exploded? A. One shell.
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Q. And there were four remaining cartridges?
A. There was three loaded. There was one empty cartridge and one empty chamber. BY THE COURT:
Q. How many chambers are there in the revolver? A. Five.
Q. There was one shell that had been exploded, you say?
A. One shell had been exploded, three full cartridges and an empty chamber.
BY MR. McINTYRE: Referring to the cartridge that you took from the chamber of that revolver, is that the shell? (Shown.)
A. Yes---38.
MR. McINTYRE: I offer the revolver in evidence and I offer the cartridges and the shell. THE COURT: There doesn't appear to be any objection. Will you mark them all together? MR. McINTYRE: Yes, sir.
The pistol, three cartridges and one empty shell are collectively marked People's Exhibit 3, February 27,
1894.
BY THE COURT;
Q. There was one shell which had been discharged?
A. There was three full cartridges, one empty shell and
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one empty chamber. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. After the revolver which has just been marked in evidence was handed to you, what did you then do?
A. I told Donnelly to put his coat on and come outside with me. I brought him out in front of Madden who was lying on the sidewalk. I asked Madden who shot him. He said James Donnelly. I said, "Is this the man"? He said, "Yes." I said, "What did he shoot you for?" He said, "I didn't say a god damned word to him."
Q. What did Mr. Donnelly say to that?
A. Donnelly didn't make any answer until on the way to the Station House. There was a big crowd of people gathered around. On the way to the Station House Donnelly told me that Madden put his hand to his pocket, to his hip pocket and that he had ordered him out of the place before. He said, "He has been raising trouble in
the place and I am afraid of the man."
Q. Did you examine the clothes of Madden? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you see any revolver on his person? A. I did not.
Q. Where was Madden taken to afterwards?
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A. To Roosevelt Hospital.
Q. Did you see Madden in the hospital? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What time?
A. The next day, but I didn't talk to him because he was lying in a stupor. Q. Was the defendant with you at the time?
A. He was locked up.
A. After that did you see Madden? A. Yes, I seen him afterwards.
Q. Where?
A. At Roosevelt Hospital. Q. Was he alive or dead?
A. I seen him dead---July 9th. Q. Where was he then?
A. He was in the morgue in Roosevelt Hospital.
Q. As soon as you heard the shot and saw Madden you gave an order for an ambulance?
A. Yes, and I sent another citizen for more officers and two more officers came there and the man was taken away.
Q. You don't know whether any officers went for the ambulance? A. No, I don't know.
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CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Officer O'Neill, how long have you been attached to the Police Department of this City? A. Three years the 19th of May.
Q. Upon what precinct were you attached upon the day of shooting? A. The 20th.
Q. Are you still attached to that precinct? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you been attached to that 20th. Precinct? A. The 19th of May next will be three years.
Q. How long have you known this defendant Donnelly?
A. Well, I have known him since October or November, 1889 but I was not acquainted with him until about a year ago before this occurred.
Q. So that for a year before this occurred you became somewhat familiarly acquainted with the defendant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you know other people who know him, do you not, Officer O'Neill? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long had you been on post in the neighborhood of
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where this saloon was at 28th Street and Eighth Avenue? A. About a year before this happened.
Q. Was your post a day post or a night post? A.
A day post.
Q. While you were on post during day times you would see this defendant from time to time? A. I would see him every other day.
Q. You have seen him in company with different people? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You have already stated that you know other people that know him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, during the length of time that you have known him, state if you know what has been his character for peace and quietness---is it good or bad?
A. I have known him always to be an excellent character and associated with decent people. Q. Now, you say it was about four o'clock when you heard the pistol shot fired?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then you saw the man whom you afterwards discovered was Madden reel out and fall? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. At that time was there any police officer near you? A. No, sir.
Q. At the time that you gave the order to the citizen to go and send under your name for an ambulance was there any other police officer present?
A. Not at that time.
Q. Now, immediately after the report of the pistol and the falling of the man and when you sent the citizen
for the ambulance, can you tell whether or not some of the people in the neighborhood crowded around Madden? A. There was a crowd of about one hundred and fifty people very near to him.
Q. And then you immediately went into the bar-room or the liquor store?
A. I went in to the bar-room first and brought Donnelly out and then the crowd commenced to come while I was taking his statement.
Q. Whose statement?
A. Madden's statement.
Q. How long do you think officer that you were in the bar-room getting the names of the people that were in there and finding out who it was that fired the shot?
A. Between five and ten minutes.
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Q. The first one you came in contact with was Ruch? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And his hat was off and you looked with suspicion upon him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then you had some conversation with him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you ask for his name?
A. Yes, sir. I got three of their names.
Q. You put it down on paper while you were in the saloon? A. Yes, sir.
Q. When you turned and asked Donnelly if he did the shooting did Donnelly hesitate at all? A. No.
Q. When you asked him for the pistol was there any hesitation on his part in giving it to you? A. No, sir.
Q. When you came out with Donnelly you say there was a crowd of about one hundred and fifty people around? A. On or about that.
Q. There was no police officer present at the time? A. No, sir.
Q. There was not?
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A. No, sir.
Q. How soon after you got out and had the conversation with Mr. Madden in the presence of the defendant was it before the ambulance came?
A. While I was going up Eighth Avenue we met the ambulance coming between 34th and 35th Streets. Q. Who was in charge of Madden then?
A. I met officer Mitchell between 31st. and 32nd. Streets and sent him down in charge. In the meantime another officer came and I took Donnelly away first.
Q. You made no search of Madden? A. No, I did not.
Q. During the ten minutes after the shooting when Madden was lying out on the sidewalk with no police officer
about or near to him there was a crowd of people standing about him anywhere from a hundred to one hundred and fifty?
A. Yes, sir.
Mrs. ELLEN E. MADDEN, a witness called on behalf of the people, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Where do you reside, Madam? A. At 228 West 29th. Street.
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Q. Where did you reside on the 28th day of May, 1893? A. In the same place.
Q. Were you the mother of Charles Madden? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you see your son in the Roosevelt Hospital in the City of New York? A. Yes, sir.
Q. When?
Q. I seen him almost every day before he died. Q. When did he die?
Q. He died on the 10th of June. Q. On the 10th of June, 1893? A. Yes, sir.
Q. In Roosevelt Hospital? A. In Roosevelt Hospital. BY THE COURT:
Q. You saw him on the 10th of June?
A. No sir; not on that day but on the day before. Q. The day before he died?
A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Where did you see him? A. In the hospital.
Q. When did you see him next? A. On the day he died.
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Q. Where?
A. When he was brought home. Q. Where to?
A. To No. 228.
Q. And he received his burial from there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you attend his funeral? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where was he buried? A. In Calvary Cemetery.
Q. How old was your son at the time of his death? A. He was going on 22 years of age.
Q. In his lifetime what did he work at? Objected to as irrelevant.
A. He used to work in a store.
THE COURT: What is the use in going into that? Haven't you got all that you want from this lady?
MR. McINTYRE: I assume there will be an attack made on the character of this man when the time comes. THE COURT: I will not anticipate anything.
MR. McINTYRE: If your Honor please I am almost through with this case but there is a witness, and a very material one, that we will be unable to produce
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here this evening. THE COURT: Why?
MR. McINTYRE: Because I have had a subpoena served upon him--- THE COURT: Who is he?
MR. McINTYRE:
A man by the name of McCabe who was in the bar-room at the time. THE COURT: Did you serve a subpoena upon him?
MR. McINTYRE: Yes, sir.
THE COURT: I will let you have until to-morrow and we will adjourn until then. (To the Jury.) There is one more witness, gentlemen, who, it seems to me, is a material witness in this case. That is the barkeeper, McCabe, and the District Attorney, for the person that he was already stated, is unable to produce that witness to-day. So I will allow him to have an opportunity of bringing the witness here to-morrow morning. Now, at the same time, gentlemen, I will have to attend the funeral of an old friend of mine which takes place at 10 o'clock. That will probably last over an hour and I propose to adjourn this case to a later hour than
usual for that reason as well as for another. The other reason is that counsel in this case
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defending this man is obliged to appear before Judge Cowing to-morrow morning at 11 o'clock at which time there is judgment to be pronounced against some person who has been tried before Judge Cowing and who was defended by Mr. House. He tells me that he desires to make certain motions in reference to that cause and, as
he will occupy probably half an hour, I would wait, anyway, until after he had got rid of that engagement before Judge Cowing. So we will not lose a great deal of time after all but you will please be here to-morrow at twelve o'clock. In the meantime you will observe the statutory requirements to which I have already called your attention. Please do not go near the premises where it is alleged that this homicide took place, and if
anything should be published in the newspapers about this case be kind enough not to read that portion of the paper. The jurors should have nothing operate on their minds except the evidence and in that way they will come to a more proper conclusion than they would if they read anything in the newspapers.
Adjourned to 12 M. WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 28, 1894.
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TRIAL RESUMED. February 28th, 1894.
THOMAS McCABE, a witness called on behalf of the People, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. McIntyre:
Q. Where is your place of business, Mr. McCabe? A. 413 West 26th Street.
Q. How long have you been engaged in business there? A.
A little over - since two days before New Years.
Q. What sort of business do you carry on there? A. I have a little liquor store there.
Q. Where were you employed on the 28th day of May, 1893? A. With Felix Donnelly.
Q. And where was his place of business? A. 28th Street and 8th Avenue.
Q. What were you doing there for him? A. Tending bar.
Q. During what time did you tend bar, if at all, on the 28th of May? A. I started in about five o'clock in the morning.
By the Court:
Q. And up to what time did you remain? By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. At what time did you cease tending bar on that day?
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A. About four o'clock in the afternoon, or probably ten minutes after four. Q. Were you relieved that afternoon?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. By whom?
A. James Donnelly.
Q. The defendant at the bar? A. Yes, sir, that's the man.
Q. Just before you were relieved by James Donnelly --- By the Court:
Q. When were you relieved? Now, when did this defendant come on duty?
A. Well, around that time, around four o'clock. It might be five or ten minutes after or before. Q. Well, you left the bar?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And he came in within a few minutes afterwards? A. He came in first and relieved me.
Q. He came in first and relieved you? A. Yes, sir.
By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. Now, who was in the store just before you were relieved by Donnelly?
A. I couldn't say exactly who was in. There was one man that I know to be in it. Q. Do you know a man by the name of Collins?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where was he standing, if he was in there at all? A. Near the upper end of the bar.
Q. And do you know a man by the name of Ruch? A. He may have been there, but I didn't know him.
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Q. Do you know a man named O'Keefe? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was he there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was he there or not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where was he standing?
A. He was standing by the lunch counter.
Q. Did you see the deceased, Madden, in the saloon at the time? A. I saw him before Donnelly come in.
Q. What was he doing?
A. He come in and bought a glass of beer. Q. Whom did he buy it of?
A. Me.
Q. And where did he go there? A. ***
The Court: Who bought the beer?
Mr. McIntyre: Madden, sir, bought a glass of beer from him. By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. When he went into the closet, where were you? A. Behind the bar.
Q. And was it when he was in the closet that Donnelly came in? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then where did you go?
A. I went in the closet when Donnelly came behind the bar.
Q. And then did you see Madden - was Madden in the closet, when you went into the closet?
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A. He must have been, ***
Q. Did anything attract your attention while you were in the closet? A.
A pistol shot; that's all.
Q. Well, did you go outside?
A. I come out, and when I got through. Q. Where did you go to?
A. Into the bar room.
Q. And whom did you see there then?
A. James Donnelly was there, and a policeman and two or three more. Q. Did you see Collins there?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where was Collins?
A. He was in the same place, at the end of the bar. Q. And where was Donnelly, the defendant?
A. He was behind the bar. Q. What part of the bar?
A. The end of it, near the ice box.
Q. Did you hear the policeman say anything to Donnelly?
A. I heard him order him to give him the revolver from behind the bar. Q. Did Donnelly give him the revolver?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And what became of Donnelly then? A. He went out with the policeman.
Q. Did you know Madden any length of time before that? A. I knew him as long as I had been working there.
172
A. He must have been, ***
Q. Did anything attract your attention while you were in the closet? A.
A pistol shot; that's all.
Q. Well, did you go outside?
A. I come out, and when I got through. Q. Where did you go to?
A. Into the bar room.
Q. And whom did you see there then?
A. James Donnelly was there, and a policeman and two or three more. Q. Did you see Collins there?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where was Collins?
A. He was in the same place, at the end of the bar. Q. And where was Donnelly, the defendant?
A. He was behind the bar. Q. What part of the bar?
A. The end of it, near the ice box.
Q. Did you hear the policeman say anything to Donnelly?
A. I heard him order him to give him the revolver from behind the bar. Q. Did Donnelly give him the revolver?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And what became of Donnelly then? A. He went out with the policeman.
Q. Did you know Madden any length of time before that? A. I knew him as long as I had been working there.
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Q. How long had you been working there before the occurrence? A.
A year ago the 5th of April last I went to work for Donnelly.
Q. And Madden went into the place frequently, didn't he? A. Not for some time before that.
Q. Not for some time before that? A. No, sir.
CROSS EXAMINATION by Mr. House:
Q. Mr. McCabe, how long were you employed as a bar tended, at 28th Street and 8th Avenue, before the shooting?
A. It is a year ago the last 5th of April; but I was for a couple of weeks in the 23rd Street store; and I
couldn't say what day I came to the 28th Street store.
Q. Now you say that Madden, for some little time before the shooting, had not been in the habit of coming into the store much; is that so?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was that because he had been ordered to stay away from there? A. I guess it must be.
By the Court:
Q. Well do you know it of your own knowledge? If you don't, say so? A. Well, I ain't sure of it.
Q. Did you ever hear him told not to come there? A. I told him.
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By Mr. House:
Q. Yes, you did tell him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And had you not, for some time before this Sunday, refused to sell him any more drink? A. Yes, sir. I told him one morning not to come in there any more.
Q. And was that because you were told by the proprietor, Mr. Felix Donnelly, to do that? A. No, sir; he never told me.
Q. Then why did you do it?
A. Oh, because I heard there was some row between them before, and I told him that. By the Court:
Q. Between whom?
A. Donnelly and Madden. By Mr. House:
Q. Between whom?
A. Donnelly and Madden.
Q. Did you hear Donnelly at any time tell him not to come into the saloon any more? A. Not to him.
Q. And when was it that you told him to stay out, and refused to sell him anything? A. I couldn't say what day it was.
Q. Well, about how long before the shooting?
A. Well, it was quite a little while; I don't know quite how long it was.
Q. Were you present in the saloon when Madden and a colored fellow by the name of Tucker had some trouble? A. Not to
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my knowledge.
Q. Did you hear about it? A. I heard about it.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. McIntyre:
Q. Now, had you seen Madden in the place frequently, off and on; hadn't you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now every time that you saw Madden in your store his conduct was that of a quiet and peaceable man; wasn't it?
A. Yes, sir, he had no trouble with me. Objected to.
By the Court:
Q. Now, as long as you saw him in this bar room - you saw him there, didn't you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You saw him more than once, didn't you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. About how many times altogether? A. Well, I couldn't say.
Q. Well, as near as you can recollect?
A. Well, I couldn't have any idea. I saw him several times. Q. Well, had you seen him a dozen times?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And on those occasions, in the store, did he behave as a quiet, peaceable man, or otherwise? A. Yes, sir.
Q. He did? A. Yes, sir.
RECROSS EXAMINATION by Mr. House:
Q. Do you mean to say, Mr. McCabe, that, as long as you had been a bar tender in that saloon, that you never knew him
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to quarrel with any one in there? A. No, sir; not to my knowledge.
Q. And did you ever know him to quarrel with a colored man named Johnson? The Court: You asked him about that before.
Mr. House: No, sir, that was as to Tucker.
The Court: Repeat the question then, Mr. Stenographer. A. No, sir; I don't know it, of my own knowledge.
By Mr. House:
Q. And weren't you on duty, and tending bar, at the time that Madden assaulted a colored fellow, by the name of Tucker?
A. I might have been, and not remember it; not to my knowledge. Q. You might have been, and not remember it?
A. Yes, sir. Things might have happened that I didn't see.
Q. And is it not true, as matter of fact, Mr. McCabe, that you might have seen this man Madden quarrel a number of times in that saloon, and not remember it now?
A. That thing might happen, too.
Q. Yes. Do you have any recollection now of this man Madden breaking a bottle over Butler's head? A. No.
Q. You say you don't recollect that? A. No, sir.
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The Court: He says no. By Mr. House:
Q. How many times in all did you - do you recollect now that this man Madden has been in that place, while you were behind the bar?
A. I couldn't tell.
Q. You could not tell? A. No, sir.
Q. He was a man who drank considerable, didn't he? A. Well just about the same as anybody else.
Q. Hadn't you ever seen him intoxicated in there? A. Well I had seen him pretty well loaded, at times. Q. You had seen him pretty well loaded, at times? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Quite often?
A. No, sir; not very often.
Q. And wouldn't he quarrel, when he was in that condition?
A. He never quarreled with anybody in the store, when I was on. Q. Are you sure of that, or don't you recollect now?
A. Yes, sir, I am sure.
Q. And you don't know what happened, when you were not there, do you? The Court: How could he? You don't know, and no one else does.
Mr. House: Well, that is all. I would like
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to have Mr. McCabe remain here. I don't want him to go away.
The Court: Well, the District Attorney will keep him here for a reasonable time. Mr. McIntyre: Mc. McCabe, you will remain in court.
WILLIAM McKENZIE, a witness called on behalf of the People, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. McIntyre:
Q. What is your official position, Mr. McKenzie?
A. Orderly; the first orderly in the surgical ward in Roosevelt Hospital. Q. On or about the 28th day of May ---
By the Court:
Q. Orderly in what hospital?
A. In the Roosevelt Hospital, sir. By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. On the 28th day of May, 1893, did you receive one Charles Madden in that hospital? A. Yes, sir, I did.
Q. And did you observe the condition of his clothing? A. I did, sir.
Q. What did you observe?
A. Well, they were very bloody;
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the vest and coat and part of the pants, undershirt and what was on his person at the time. Q. Did you take what was on his person at the time?
A. I did, sir.
Q. What did you take? A. Nothing at all.
Q. Any revolver or knife, or anything of that sort? A. No, sir, nothing at all.
CROSS EXAMINATION. Mr. House: No questions.
Mr. McIntyre: The People rest.
Mr. House: If your Honor please, the State having rested their case, the defendant now moves that the Court advise - the defendant moves that the Court take from the consideration of this jury the crime of murder in
the first degree, on the ground that the people have failed to establish facts which are sufficient to constitute that degree of crime.
The Court: There is proof in the case, as it stands, that this defendant killed the deceased; that is, that he inflicted upon him a mortal wound, from the effects of which he subsequently died. He has, therefore, committed a homicide.
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Mr. House: Yes, sir.
The Court: And it will be a question for the jury to determine, what grade of homicide he has committed. Mr. House: Your Honor will kindly give me the benefit of an exception.
The Court: And, therefore, I will deny your application, and give you an exception. Is there any other motion?
Mr. House: And I also make a like motion regarding murder in the second degree. The Court: The same ruling.
Mr. House: The same ruling, sir; and the same exception.
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THE DEFENSE.
MICHAEL J. GROH, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. House:
Q. Whereabouts do you reside, Mr. Groh? A. 329 West 27th Street.
Q. And what is your business, Mr. Groh? A. I am in the brewing business.
Q. How long have you been engaged in that business in this city? A. Eleven years.
Q. Do you know the defendant, James Donnelly? A. I do.
Q. How long have you known him?
A. Some where between four and five years. Q. Do you know other people that know him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, Mr. Groh, do you know what the defendant's character is for peace and quietness, and, if so, is it good or bad?
A. It is good.
CROSS EXAMINATION by Mr. McIntyre:
Q. Now, what concern are you connected with, Mr. Groh? A. M. Groh's Sons.
Q. You are brewers? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you sell lager beer and other malt liquors to the defendant, don't you? A. No, sir.
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Q. Well, then, to his brothers? A. No, sir; to his employer.
Q. Well, to his brothers too, don't you? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, you sell to Felix Donnelly; don't you? A. That is not his brother.
Q. Well, don't you sell to Felix Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now he is a cousin of the defendant at the bar, isn't he? A. Well, I believe he is.
Q. Well now you know it, don't you? A. I said so, just a minute ago.
Q. Well, now you know it, don't you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, what other Donnelly do you sell malt liquors to? A. No other Donnelly.
Q. Well, how long have you known the defendant at the bar? A. Four or five years.
Q. Now, are you a salesman for the concern that you represent? A. No, sir; I am a principal.
Q. Well, do you solicit trade yourself? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, do you have occasion to go to the saloon at 28th Street and 8th Avenue very often? A. Well, it is within four hundred feet of our place.
Q. Well how often did you have occasion to go there before this shooting?
A. Well, perhaps five or six times a week, or several times a day, as the case might be.
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Q. Did you see the defendant there every day you went there? A. Well I saw him there very often.
Q. Well, about how many times? By the Court:
Q. How often can you state that you saw him, to the best of your recollection? A. Oh, a hundred times.
By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. And you have discussed his character, you say, among people who know him? A. No, I have not.
Q. Well, I understood you to say that you knew people who knew him? A. Yes, sir, I said that.
Q. And that his character is good among those people? A. I presume so.
By the Court:
Q. Did you ever hear any one discuss his character, Mr. Groh? A. No one.
By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. Well then all that you know about his character is that you went into that place, at 28th Street and 8th
Avenue, nearly every day, as you state, and that you saw the defendant behind the bar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And that is all you know of him? A. Yes, sir.
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REDIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. House:
Q. And you have observed him all during this time? A. Yes, sir, I have.
JAMES K. PRICE, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. House:
Q. You are a captain of police? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you been attached to the police department of this city, Captain? A. Twenty years, coming this December.
Q. How long have you been a captain of police? A. Fourteen months.
Q. To what precinct are you attached? A. To the 20th.
Q. Were you attached to that precinct on the 28th day of May, 1893? A. I was.
Q. And you are then familiar, or, that is, you knew of the shooting of Madden? I say, you knew then of the shooting of Madden?
By the Court:
Q. You learned of it?
A. Yes, sir, I learned of it that day. By Mr. House:
Q. Now, after Donnelly was brought to your station house, and the case came into your hands, did you make an investiga-
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tion, to learn the facts? A. I did.
Q. And, during that investigation, did you find out anything about the character of the defendant, Donnelly? A. Nothing; only from the officers.
The Court: That will hardly do, Mr. House. You can prove his general character for peace and quietness. Mr. House: Yes, sir.
By Mr. House:
Q. Did you, during your investigation, find out what was the character of the defendant, his general character for peace and quietness; and, if so, was it good or bad?
By the Court:
Q. No, no. Do you know other people who know him, this defendant? A. I never met the man before that day.
Q. No, but do you know other people who know him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. In that neighborhood? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know what his reputation in that neighborhood is for peace and quietness, among those who know him? A. He had the reputation of being a peaceable man, previous to this thing happening.
By Mr. House:
Q. Yes. Now did you come in contact with people who knew Mad-
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den in his lifetime?
A. In my investigation, after the arrest?
Q. Yes, in your investigation after the arrest. A. Yes, sir.
Q. And did you find out what his reputation was for being a peaceable and quiet man? Objected to.
The Court: That will not do, Mr. House, for the simple reason that anybody might run around - I don't say that this captain of police did anything of the sort - but anybody might run around, and get among people who were feeling anything but amiable, or who had any feeling of enmity against another, and might blast his character and reputation in that kind of way.
Mr. House: Very well, sir. That is all, Captain. CROSS EXAMINATION by Mr. McIntyre:
Q. Captain, how long have you been connected with the precinct in which --- By the Court:
Q. How long were you in that precinct, Captain? By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. Previous to the day of the shooting? A. I was sent to
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that precinct on the 7th of January, 1893.
Q. Now, Donnelly never came to your station house, and made any complaint against a man by the name of Madden, during the time that you were there; did he?
A. No, sir. I never met the gentleman until the day of the shooting.
Q. You never had any complaint made there of the cutting of a negro by Madden, did you? A. I heard of it, but whether it was previous to the shooting or not ---
The Court: No, that will not do. By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. But did you have a complaint made at the station house of any such affair? A. No, sir, I did not.
Q. And you knew nothing of Madden personally, did you? A. Only by repute.
Q. After the shooting? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And personally you know nothing about the defendant at the bar, Donnelly? A. Only by repute.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. House:
Q. Captain, did you hear by repute, after the shooting, that Madden was recognized as a quarrelsome man? Objected to; objection sustained; exception.
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BERNARD CAMPBELL, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. House:
Q. Mr. Campbell, whereabouts do you reside? A. 547 West 37th Street.
Q. What is your business, Mr. Campbell? A. Fertilizing business.
Q. And how long have you been engaged in business of that character in this city? A. About three years.
Q. How long have you been a resident of this city, Mr. Campbell? A. About nineteen years, or twenty.
Q. About nineteen years or twenty? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know the defendant, James Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you known him, about, Mr. Campbell? A. Well, about fifteen or sixteen years, I should judge.
Q. Do you know other people who know him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, Mr. Campbell, do you know what his general character is for peace and quietness; and, if so, is it good or bad?
A. Well, as far as I know, his character is very good. CROSS EXAMINATION by Mr. McIntyre:
Q. What is your business? A. Fertilizing.
Q. Where is your place of business?
A. At the foot of 16th Street, North River.
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Q. What kind of fertilizer do you sell? A. Manure.
Q. Do you do any business with the Donnellys? A. No, sir.
Q. None at all? A. No, sir.
Q. Do you know Felix Donnelly? A. Felix Donnelly? In 30th Street?
Q. The one who keeps the place at 28th Street and 8th Avenue?
A. Well, I couldn't say that I know him. I might have met him somewhere. Q. Do you know Patrick Donnelly, the brother?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did he ask you to come here and testify? A. No, sir.
Q. Who did?
A. I don't know. I was served with a summons yesterday.
Q. You have known the defendant, you say, for fifteen and sixteen years? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How did you make his acquaintance? A. Well, I have met him different times. Q. Where?
A. Well, I have met him different times. Q. Well, where have you met him?
A. Well, he worked for me for about six months once. Q. When did he work for you?
A. Well, I couldn't say exactly what year it was. Q. Well, how long ago, about?
A. About three or four years ago.
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Q. What did he do for you? A. He tended bar for me.
Q. He tended bar for you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then you kept a liquor saloon? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And where did you keep it? A. 26th Street and 9th Avenue.
Q. Well, how long did he work for you, tending bar? A. About six months.
Q. Well, did you discharge him or did he leave you? A. I cant be sure of that.
Q. Well, let us be sure about that. Did he leave of his own volition, or did you discharge him? A. Well, he left at that time.
By the Court:
Q. Well, Mr. Campbell, have you any recollection now, so as to be able to answer that question? Can you state whether you discharged him, when he left your employment, or whether he left of his own accord?
A. Well, yes sir. I would say that he left of his own accord. By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. Now, did he work for you at any other time? A. No.
Q. How? A. No, sir.
Q. And you say that he left of his own accord? A. Yes, sir.
Q. But you are not sure about it?
A. Yes, sir; I am quite sure now that he left of his own accord, and went to work
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for some one else.
Q. Well, are you in the liquor business now? A. No, sir.
Q. How long have you been out of it? A. About three years.
Q. And how long were you in it? A. About twelve or thirteen years.
Q. Yes. Now, from the time that he left your employ, down to the killing of Madden, how many times did you see this defendant?
A. Well, I couldn't say positively how often.
Q. Well, now, you say that you heard people discuss his character? The Court: No; I did not understand him to say that.
By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. Well, you say that his character in the community in which he resides is good, for peace and quiet? A. No, sir; I only say what I know about him.
By the Court:
Q. Well you said, of your own knowledge, as far as you were able to judge, that the defendant's character for peace and quietness was very good?
A. Yes, sir.
By Mr. McIntyre:
Q. Well, have you ever heard anybody say that his character was good?
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By the Court:
Q. Have you ever heard anybody discuss his character at all? A. No, sir, no, your Honor, I never did.
Q. You never heard anybody question his character? A. No, sir.
Q. Or say anything about his character, did you? A. No, sir; not at all.
Q. And so that all your knowledge of this man's character is what you saw of him, when he was in your employment, and what you happened to see of him since?
A. Yes, sir; but I knew him for years before that.
Q. Well, is it what you saw of him, and of your own knowledge? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And it is not what you learned from anybody else? A. No, sir; no, your Honor.
PATRICK McKENNA, witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. House:
Q. Please take a seat, Father. Father, to what church are you attached in the city now? A. I am not in the city now.
Q. Where are you attached?
A. I am out on Long Island. The church that I am attached to is St. Joseph's.
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Q. Do you know the defendant at the bar, James Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you known him, about? A. Well, I knew him when he was a baby. Q. Well, from childhood up?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, then, you know a good many other people who know him? A. Yes, sir, I knew his father and mother.
Q. Now, what is his character for peace and quietness, if you know; is it good or bad? A. I never heard anything against him, for peace and quiet.
Q. It has always been good?
A. Yes, sir; I always found him to be a quiet and inoffensive man, as far as I ever heard. Mr. McIntyre: No questions.
The Court: Now, gentlemen, you can have a recess until a quarter past two o'clock; and you will observe the statutory admonition.
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AFTERNOON SESSION.
JOHN JEROLOMON, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. You are an attorney and counselor at law in this City? A. I am, sir.
Q. Q. How long have you been engaged in the practice of your profession in this City? A. Since 1868 or 1869.
Q. You have been Judge of one of the district courts? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know the defendant at the Bar, Donnelly? A. I do.
Q. How long have you known him?
A. I have known him and his brothers and his cousins for fifteen years. Q. Do you know many other people who know him also?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know what the general character of this defendant for that time has been for peace and quietness, and if so, is it good or bad?
A. It has been excellent all that time, sir. CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Donnelly was one of your constituents when you were elected to the Bench?
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A. I had some of the Donnellys for my constituents.
Q. And that accounts for the immense majority you obtained? A. He was one of the number.
JAMES J. McCUSKER, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. You are a Catholic priest? A. That is my profession.
Q. Where is your church located?
A. On the corner of York and Jay Streets, Brooklyn. Q. Do you know the defendant at the Bar, Father? A. I do.
Q. How long have you known him?
A. I have known him since he was born.
Q. Do you know other people that know him also? A. I do, any number of people.
Q. Now, for the time that you have known this defendant what has been his character for peace and quietness, if you know, good or bad?
A. I knew him as a child for a number of years--until
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about fifteen years ago, perhaps, I knew little of him as a boy but for the past fifteen years I will say I
have known him as a man, as a young man, and during that time I have never known anything against his character or what was not becoming as a respectable citizen.
No cross examination.
JOHN EARLY, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Where do you reside, Mr. Early? A. 310 West 30th Street.
Q. What is your business? A. Furnisher and carpets.
Q. How long have you been engaged in that business in this City? A. Since 1867.
Q. Do you know the defendant Donnelly at the Bar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know other people that know him? A. I do, I know his brothers and cousins.
Q. How long have you known Donnelly? A. About twelve years, I believe.
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Q. During this period of time do you know what his general character for peace and quietness has been, and if so, has it been good or bad?
A. It has been good since I knew him. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. What is your business? A. Furnisher and carpets.
Q. Do you sell goods, merchandise, furniture and carpets to the Donnelly's? A. Yes, sir.
Q. That is all.
A. None to him.
JOHN TURNEY, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Where do you reside? A. 417 West 34th. Street. Q. What is your business?
A. I am connected with the firm of Bambach & Som in the cigar business. Q. How long have you been connected with that concern?
A. About seven years.
Q. Do you know the defendant Donnelly? A. Yes sir.
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Q. How long have you known him?
A. I have known him about six years, I think. Q. Do you know other people who know him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, what has been his general character for peace and quietness since you have known him, good or bad? A. Good, exceedingly quiet.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Your concern I take it sells cigars from time to time to the Donnellys, Felix Donnelly and the other
Donnellys?
A. We do occasionally, yes.
Q. It is because of the fact that you have had occasion to ***go there on business that you saw the defendant at the Bar in the store?
A. Well, I have known him for many years outside of the business.
Q. Were you not at one time connected with Judge Jerolomon's court? A. I was.
Q. You knew Donnelly then?
A. Not in connection with the court.
Q. Not in connection with the court but in connection with Judge Jerolomon?
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A. Not the defendant.
PATRICJ McCAGNE***Y a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Where do you reside? A. 449 West 31st. Street.
Q. You have been a Juror frequently in the Criminal Courts of this City, have you not? Objected to as absolutely immaterial.
THE COURT: I will let him answer. A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know the defendant at the Bar, Mr. McCagney? A. I do sir.
Q. How long have you known him? A. Fifteen years or more.
Q. Do you know other people that know him? A. I do.
Q. What is his general character for peace and quietness, if you know, and is it good or bad? A. It is good and exceedingly quiet in my judgment. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You say his reputation for peace and quietness is good. What observations have you made that permit you to come down her and volunteer that
200
A. Not the defendant.
PATRICJ McCAGNE***Y a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Where do you reside? A. 449 West 31st. Street.
Q. You have been a Juror frequently in the Criminal Courts of this City, have you not? Objected to as absolutely immaterial.
THE COURT: I will let him answer. A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know the defendant at the Bar, Mr. McCagney? A. I do sir.
Q. How long have you known him? A. Fifteen years or more.
Q. Do you know other people that know him? A. I do.
Q. What is his general character for peace and quietness, if you know, and is it good or bad? A. It is good and exceedingly quiet in my judgment. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You say his reputation for peace and quietness is good. What observations have you made that permit you to come down her and volunteer that
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statement. How often have you been in contact with him and observed all his acts? A. His employer, Mr. Campbell--
BY THE COURT:
Q. How much of him have you seen during the last ten years? A. Once a week or some times twice.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. What business did you say you were in? A. I am in the agency business.
Q. What kind of an agency? A. I buy and sell property.
Q. Stores?
A. I sell liquor stores.
Q. Did you ever sell any stores for the Donnellys?
A. No, sir. I never had any dealings with the Donnelly family in any manner that I know of. MR. HOUSE: Call John Deering.
THE COURT: I think you have reached your limit. You have got nine witnesses who have already testified to character. I will limit your examination to this witness.
MR. HOUSE: Very well sir.
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JOHN DEERING, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows. DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Where do you reside? A. 384 Ninth Avenue.
Q. What is your business? A. Plumber.
Q. How long have you been engaged in the plumbing business in this City? A. About 35 years.
Q. Do you know the defendant at the Bar? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you known him, Mr. Dee ring? A. I have known him about ten years, I think.
Q. Do you know other people that know him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know what the defendant's general character for peace and quietness is and if so is it good or bad? A. Good.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Do you do business with any of the Donnelly's? A. No, sir.
Q. How often have you seen this man in ten years?
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A. Sometimes I might see him once a week and sometimes I might see him twice a weak.
MR. HOUSE: May I be ***pe permitted to call one more to make the compliment of twelve, your Honor? We are entitled to twelve.
THE COURT: There is no limit. It is entirely in the discretion of the Court. Yes. We will stop on that one though for the present. I only do it because it is a capital case.
MR. HOUSE: I understand that your Honor and I am much obliged to you.
JOHN TURNEY, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. What is your business?
A. Coal business--coal dealer.
Q. Whereabouts is your place of business? A. 514 and 516 West 34th. Street.
Q. Do you know the defendant Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you known him?
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A. Thirteen or fourteen years.
Q. Do you know other people who know him? A. I do.
A. I do.
Q. What has been his general character for peace and quietness, during that time, if you know***and if so, is it good or bad?
A. Good, sir.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE: Q. Are you in business for yourself?
A. I am with my father.
Q. You sell coal to the Donnellys? A. Occasionally.
Q. Now, you have known the defendant for how long? A. Thirteen or four teen years.
Q. Do you visit him in his house? A. In his house?
Q. Yes.
A. What do you mean by his house? Q. Where he resides.
A. Not very often.
Q. Do you know where he ever resided? A. Yes.
Q. Where?
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A. With his brother. Q. Where is that?
A. 28th Street and Ninth Avenue. Q. What brother?
A. John Donnelly his name is.
Q. 28th Street and Ninth Avenue? A. Yes.
Q. Did you ever visit him in his house? A. I have.
Q. How many times? A. Two or three times.
Q. Where else did you visit him? A. Well, probably I had seen him-- Q. Tell me positively.
A. Corner of 28th Street and Eighth Avenue. Q. How many times?
A. Two or three times.
Q. Now where else did you see him? A. Probably on the street.
Q. How many times? A. Several times.
Q. And you come down here and you say you know his
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character for peace and quietness to be good? A. Yea, sir.
MR. McINTYRE: That is all.
PETER BOYER, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Mr. Boyer where do you reside? A. 320 West 32nd, Street.
Q. What is your business? A. Restaurant.
Q. Where is your restaurant? A. 466 Eighth Avenue.
Q. How long hav***er you been engaged in business, Mr. Boyer? A. Since 1864.
Q. Do you know the defendant Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you known him? A. About five or six years.
Q. Do you know other people who know him? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. Do you know what his general character for peace and quietness is and if so is it good or bad? A. Good.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Does he dine in your place. A. Occasionally.
JOHN BUT***LER, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECTEXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Your full name is what? A. John Butler.
Q. Whereabouts do you reside, Mr. Butler? A. 210 West 29th Street.
Q. How long have you been residing at that number? A. About three months.
Q. Prior to your residing at No. 210 West 29th Street, where did you live? A. In the rear.
Q. What is your business at present, Mr. Butler?
A. Porter, but I have been driving lately on the Street Cleaning Department. Q. What was your business on the 28th day of May, 1893?
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A. Porter.
Q. Whereabouts were you employed in that business? A. 362 Eighth Avenue.
Q. was that the saloon that was owned by Mr. Felix Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And the saloon in which the defendant was one of the bartenders? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long had you been employed at that saloon as a porter? A. About three years.
Q. Did you know Madden in his lifetime? A. I did.
Q. How long had you known Madden? A. About two and one half years.
Q. Where did you become acquainted with him? A. On that corner?
Q. On that corner? A. Yes, sir.
Q. During those two and one half years did you see very much of him? A. Yes, I saw him nearly every day.
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Q. Would you see him out on the corner? A. I did.
Q. Would you see him in the saloon? A. Yea, sir.
Q. Did you during the two and one half years that you have seen him in the saloon and on the corner nearly everyday have an opportunity to observe him?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now what was his character during that time? Was he a peaceable man or was he a quarrelsome man? A. He was a quarrelsome man.
Q. Was he a man that drank? A. He did.
Q. Did you ever see him drink? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you ever see him in***toxicated? A. I have.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you ever drink with him yourself? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Do you know a man by the name of Henry Johnson? A. I do.
Q. He is a colored man, is he not?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. Were you present in the saloon at the time Johnson and Madden had their difficulty? MR. McINTYRE: Objected to.
BY THE COURT:
Q. When was it? You ought to find that out first. (To the witness.) Were you present at any difficulty between
Madden and Johnson? A. I was not there.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. You were not there? A. No, sir.
Q. Do you know about what time that difficulty took place? MR. McINTYRE: Objected to. THE COURT: That wont do at all.
Q. You heard there was some difficulty between John son and Madden at one time? MR. HcINTYRE: Objected to.
MR. HOUSE: That is done for the purpose of fixing a time. THE COURT: I will allow it for that purpose.
A. Yes, I heard it.
Q. Now, about two months after you heard of the difficulty--
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THE COURT: No, no. When?
Q. When did you hear of the difficulty between Johnson and Madden? A. I heard it the same night.
Q. The same night it occurred?
A. I ***aint got the date what time it happened. I was at-- BY THE COURT:
Q. Never mind, now. When was it as near as you can recollect? A. Well, I think it was in May, I ***aint sure.
Q. What year?
A. 1892--1893, I should say. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Was it in May or February, 1893?
A. I can not tell the time exactly because I did not take any particular account of the month.
Q. What I want to get is some time after you Heard of the difficulty between Johnson and Madden, did you see
Madden in the saloon at the 28th Street store? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Who was behind at ***he bar at that time? A. Tom McCabe.
Q. Did you ever see Donnelly behind the bar after the difficulty between Madden and Johnson when you were
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212 present?
THE COURT: Wait a minute. He does not know, of course. MR. HOUSE: He says he heard of it.
THE COURT: That wont ***do. You have not fixed any time.
MR. HOUSE: I can fix the time by telling the witness but I don't want to do that.
THE COURT: You may be able to fix the time by some other witness and then you may call this witness back. MR. HOUSE: I will try and get it another way.
Q. Do you recollect the Sunday of May 28th, 1893? A. I do.
Q. That was the day of the killing? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now were you in the store at the time the shot was fired? A. I were not?
A. Now, at some time before that Sunday, were you in that saloon when Donnelly and Madden were present and something was said about Madden getting a drink?
A. I were.
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Q. Now I am trying to fix the time. Please tell me when that was, if you can, with regard to the Sunday when the shooting took place--about how long before that?
A. That is about two weeks previous.
Q. Who was behind a the bar at that time? A. James Donnelly.
Q. Now, did you hear any conversation passed between the defendant Donnelly and the man Madden? A. I did not.
Q. Where were you at the time?
A. Well, I was in the building but I suppose I was attending to something else.
Q. Did you ever before the shooting hear Madden ask Donnelly to sell him a drink? A. I did.
Q. How long before the shooting? Can you fix that time, the first time that you ever heard Madden ask Donnelly for a drink?
A. Well, it was about ***three weeks--about three weeks previous to that time.
Q. I am not talking about the shooting, Mr. Butler. I am trying to cane down to a time before the shooting. I
ask you whether you ever hoard any conversation
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between the defendant Donnelly and Madden regarding Donnelly's selling Madden a drink? A. I hoard Madden come in and ask for a drink.
Q. How long before the shooting was that? A. About three weeks.
Q. Go on.
A. Madden asked him for a drink and Donnelly says, "No, I was told not to sell you any." Q. What time of the day was this, if you recall?
A. It was in the afternoon. Q. Go on.
A. And he says, "I will not sell you anything because it is against orders because you raise too much trouble around the place when you get drunk."***
Q. What did Madden sty to that?
A. He says, "Oh, hell; I want a drink; if I here I can get it some place else, but I want the drink while I am here." Donnelly says, "I wont sell it to you."
Q. What did Madden do? A. He went out.
Q. Before Madden was going out, did you hear him say anything
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to Donnelly, and if so, what?
A. When ho was going out at that time he did not say anything. Q. Did he come back again that same day?
A. He came back again that same day.
Q. Who was in the bar-room at that time, behind the bar? A. Tom McCabe.
Q. Did Donnelly some in there at any time that afternoon? A. Not while I was there he did not.
Q. Was Tucker in there at the time?
A Tucker was in there but not at that same time, but on that day previous
Tucker came in there.
Q. Were you in there when Tucker was there? A. Yes, I were.
Q. Who was behind the bar at that time? A. Tom McCabe.
Q. Was Madden in there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you see Tucker go up to the bar? A. I did.
Q. Did Tucker ask for anything?
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A. He asked for a drink.
Q. Who did he ask for that drink? A. Tom McCabe.
Q. Where was Madden at the time?
A. Well, he was standing to the right of him at the bar.
Q. Did you see Madden do anything to Tucker at that time? MR, McINTYRE: Objected to. A. Yea, I did.
Q. MR. McINTYRE: Wait a moment.
***THE COURT: He says, "Yes, I did." Q. Now, I ask you what he did.
MR. McINTYRE: Objected to.
THE COURT: No. You can show the man's general reputation but you can not show a specific act. Nobody knows that better than you do.
Exception by defendant.
Q. Mr. Butler, do you recollect that at any time before the shooting you were in the saloon when Donnelly was behind the bar and Madden was there and Madden had an iron cuspador in his hand?
MR. McINTYRE: Objected to as leading. Objection overruled.
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A. I recollect.
Q. Will you please tell me how long before the shooting that was? A. Well, about two and one half weeks.
Q. What time of the day was it that Madden was in the saloon?
A. Madden wan in the saloon in the afternoon about six o'clock, as near as I can come at it. Q. Who else was in the saloon?
A. Well there was two or three others in there but I didn't know exactly who they were. Q. You don't know who they were?
A. No, sir.
Q. Now, were you in the saloon all the time? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was there any conversation passing between Donnelly and Madden-- I mean Donnelly the defendant? A. There was a conversation but what the conversation was I don't know.
Q. What did you see Madden do, if anything?
A. I seen Madden take up a cusp***idor and tell him he would brain him behind the bar.
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Q. What did Donnelly say?
A. Donnelly didn't say a word to him but just stood and looked at him. Q. Did Madden go out then?
A. No, sir. His friends made him put the cuspador down and took him out.
Q. Now, did you see Madden in the saloon at any other time before the shooting? A. Before the shooting?
Q. Yes. Q. Yes.
A. No, I didn't see him after that. I didn't see him in the saloon, I Saw him going out of the saloon. Q. You saw him going out of the saloon?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. was that the time he made some remarks?
A. I was at the boot-black's stand--I was standing by my stand and he came out the swinging doors and he said--
MR. McINTYRE: Objected to. BY THE COURT:
Q. When was this--how long before the shooting was this? A. I think it was about four weeks before the shooting.
THE COURT: He has a right to show that he made
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219 threats.
MR. McINTYRE: Yea, threats communicated to the defendant.
THE COURT: It don't make any difference whether it was communicated to the defendant or not. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Go on. That was about four weeks before the shooting? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What time of day was it, Mr. Butler, if you recollect?
A. It was near seven o'clock. He was going to his supper. BY THE COURT:
Q. What did he say? You are talking now about the dead man.
A. He remarked and he says, "I will do you a damned sight worse than I done the coon. I wont take any threats from you; I will make corpse of you."
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Did you ***go into the saloon after he had passed out? A. I did not.
Q. Did you see Donnelly after that? A. I seen him afterwards.
Q. How long afterwards?
A. We***ll, I guess about half an hour or an hour after that.
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Q. Did you communicate to him then what you had heard Madden say as he was going out? MR. McINTYRE: That is objected to.
BY THE COURT:
Q. He came out of the room? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And he said, "I will do you a damned sight worse than I done the coon?" A. Yes, sir.
Q. Who did he say that to?
A. When he said that he looked back toward the door at Donnelly. Q. was Donnelly outside the do or?
A. No, sir.
Q. Was Donnelly in the saloon at the time? Q. You are sure about that?
A. Yes, he was behind the bar. Madden was standing at the door. CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Butler, You have been working for a gambling house, haven't you? A. I have.
Q. How many times have you been convicted? A. Never.
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Q. Were you not arrested and convicted for an assault? A. I was arrested at one time.
Q. What for?
A. For fighting.
Q. What became of you? A. Dismissed--discharged.
Q. Who were you fighting with? No answer.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Were you fighting? A. Yes, I was.
Q. Were you fined? A. No sir; I were not. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Were you sent to the Penitentiary? A. No, sir.
Q. Were you sent to the City Prison? A. No, sir.
Q. What gambling house did you work for?
A. 333 Pennsylvania Avenue, Washington, D. C. Q. Where else?
Q. No other gambling house.
Q. Did you ever work for a gambler named Taylor? A. Yes, sir. That is the same place.
Q. You were born in Virginia?
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A. I were.
Q. When did you leave Virginia?
A. I left Virginia I guess about-- I have not been home inside of seven years or more. Q. What did you leave Virginia for?
A. Looking for better wages.
Q. What work did you do in Virginia? A. I worked on a farm.
Q. How much did you get there? Q. I got different prices.
Q. How much at any one time?
A. I used to work myself by the day. Q. How much did you get per day?
A. From seventy five cents to one dollar per day. Q. And you went from Virginia to Washington?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you went into a gambling house in washing to work? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You abandoned a legitimate pursuit to go into an illegitimate pursuit?
THE COURT: You have got the facts. He left farming which was a legitimate pursuit and went into the gambling business which was not.
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Q. What else did you do in Washington? A. I worked for a contractor there.
Q. Did he discharge you? A. No, sir.
Q. You left him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What for?
A. For another job.
Q. What was the job?
A. I went into a cabinet shop.
Q. How much did you get from the contractor? A. $1.50 a day.
Q. How much did you get in the cabinet shop? A. $7 a week.
Q. You left a job that paid you $1.50 a day to go to work for a cabinet maker where you earned $2 less per week?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you left of your own accord? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, where else did you work? A. After I left there?
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A. When I left there I worked a while in Baltimore. Q. What were you doing there?
A. I was a porter. Q. For whom?
A. I worked for the Ericsson Steamboat Company. Q. How long did you work for that company?
A. About two years.
Q. How much did you get per week there? A. I was paid by the month.
Q. How much per month? A. Fifteen dollars.
Q. What did you leave for? A. I got tired.
Q. Tired of work? Where did you go then? A. I came to New York.
Q. You got tired working for the Baltimore Steamship Company and then you came here? A. I went to Washington, and I went home.
Q. Did you go back to Virginia? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you go back to work on the farm? A. No.
Q. What supported you when you were not at work?
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A. The money I had made.
Q. How much had you saved? A. I don't know exactly.
Q. How long did you live in idleness? A. Not so very*** long.
Q. How long?
A. I couldn't tell you.
Q. Three, or four or five months? A. No.
Q. Three or four or five weeks?
A. Three or four weeks, I suppose.
Q. And then you went down to Washington, did you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What did you do when you went down to Washington? A. I worked there a while and then came to New York.
Q. What work were you doing there in Washington? A. I was working on the street.
Q. What doing? Q. For whom?
A. I don't know the man's name. I forget. Q. How long did you Work there?
A. I didn't work there very long.
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A. The money I had made.
Q. How much had you saved? A. I don't know exactly.
Q. How long did you live in idleness? A. Not so very*** long.
Q. How long?
A. I couldn't tell you.
Q. Three, or four or five months? A. No.
Q. Three or four or five weeks?
A. Three or four weeks, I suppose.
Q. And then you went down to Washington, did you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What did you do when you went down to Washington? A. I worked there a while and then came to New York.
Q. What work were you doing there in Washington? A. I was working on the street.
Q. What doing? Q. For whom?
A. I don't know the man's name. I forget. Q. How long did you Work there?
A. I didn't work there very long.
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Q. How long? A. I don't know.
Q. You don't remember? A. No.
Q. And then you came to New York? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What did you leave the contractor for that you had been laying the concrete for? A. I was looking for another job.
Q. You had a job down there.
A. Yes, but you know when a man has one job he gets tired. Q. Tired of work?
A. I looked for some thing else. Q. You came to New York then? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What sort of a job did you look for? A. I got a porter's job.
Q. Where?
A. 7 and 9 Union Square.
Q. Did you get tired of that job? A. I didn't get tired of it.
Q. What kind of business were the people engaged in at
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79 Union Square?
A. It was bric-a-brac place. Q. Did you leave that place? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Were you not discharged?
A. No, sir. I was not discharged. I was laid off when work was slack. I was the last man there. Q. When were you laid off?
A. Well, I don't know exactly the date.
Q. How long did you work in that place on Union Square? A. I guess about six months.
Q. How long ago was it? A. In 1892.
Q. What was the man's name? Q. Snyder & Campbell.
Q. Were you not discharged for stealing? A. No, sir.
Q. Where did you work after that?
A. I went as a waiter to Watch Hill, Rhode Island. Q. What did you do there?
Q. Waited, went as a waiter-man. Q. In what place.
Q. At the Watch Hill House.
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Q. How long did you stay there? A. Until the end of the season. Q. Were you discharged?
A. At the end of the season I had to go. Q. Were you discharged?
A. Certainly I was discharged when the ho use was closed. Q. Where did you go then?
A. Came to New York.
Q. And then where did you go? A. I began to work again.
Q. For whom?
A. For Jacob Appel.
Q. What sort of a place was that? A. I was janitor.
Q. What sort of a business was his? A. Real estate.
Q. Where was his place of business?
A. 23rd. Street--I don't know the number. Q. And Eighth Avenue?
A. Yes, near that.
Q. Isn't that a liquor store?
A. He has a liquor store in the place.
Q. What else did you say his business was?
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A. Real estate.
Q. Where is his real estate office? A. Next to the ***liquor store.
Q. How long did you work for him?
A. I don't know how long I worked for him. Q. You can not tell how long?
A. No, sir.
Q. Is your mind a blank as to the length of time you have worked in these various places? A. I don't remember.
Q. Do you ***remember how much you got a week? A. I remember how much I got a week.
Q. How much? A. $9.
Q. What did you leave him for? Did you get tired? A. Yes, I got tired.
Q. And then where did you go?
A. Well, I went to work in another place. Q. What place was that?
A. 365 Eighth Avenue. Q. What sort of a place? A. Janitor.
Q. For whom?
229
A. Real estate.
Q. Where is his real estate office? A. Next to the ***liquor store.
Q. How long did you work for him?
A. I don't know how long I worked for him. Q. You can not tell how long?
A. No, sir.
Q. Is your mind a blank as to the length of time you have worked in these various places? A. I don't remember.
Q. Do you ***remember how much you got a week? A. I remember how much I got a week.
Q. How much? A. $9.
Q. What did you leave him for? Did you get tired? A. Yes, I got tired.
Q. And then where did you go?
A. Well, I went to work in another place. Q. What place was that?
A. 365 Eighth Avenue. Q. What sort of a place? A. Janitor.
Q. For whom?
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A.
A man named, I think, Pete Volmer. Q. What were your duties there?
A. I was janitor.
Q. Is that a flat house? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long did you work for him? A. About four months.
Q. Did you get tired at the end of the four months? A. I had another job on the outside.
Q. What sort of a job? A. At Donnelly's store. Q. During what?
A. Cleaning around the place.
Q. How much were you paid for your work as janitor in the house of Volmer's? Q.
A month?
A. Yes.
Q. How much did you get at Donnelly's? A. Well, I got $4 a week.
Q. $16 a month? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, the work that you did as janitor was actually
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done in the night time?
A. No, sir; I done it in the morning.
Q. Did Volmer object to your holding the place at Donnelly's? A. No, sir.
Q. You held both places? A. I did.
Q. Because you had got another job you abandoned the job at Volmer's? A. No, sir.
Q. What did you leave there for? A. When they sold the place.
Q. Didn't you say a moment ago you had a job on the outside? A. I said that was Mr. Donnelly's.
Q. Were you working at Donnelly's and Volmer's at the same time? A. Oh, yes.
Q. And then Volmer sold the place? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You were discharged? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long did you work for Donnelly?
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A. I worked for Donnelly a little over three years. Q. When did you first go to work for him?
A. I don't remember when I first went to work because I was working around the place. I was a porter there. Q. Have you been getting $16 a month all the while from Donnelly?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What do you do, attend the free lunch counter? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You have a boot-black stand outside? A. I have a boot-black stand outside.
Q. That boot-black stand is situated right on the corner? A. Right on the corner.
Q. You are there most of the time on that corner? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Outside? A. Yes, sir.
Q. From that boot-black stand you can't see the bar, can you? A. From my boot-black stand?
Q. From where the boot-black stand is usually situated? THE COURT: No, that particular stand. (To the
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witness.) You know where that stand is? A. Yea, sir.
Q. When you were at your boot-black stand could you see from the stand to the bar? A. I could see to the front door.
Q. Can you see to the bar? A. No, sir; not inside.
Q. (By Mr. McIntyre.) You know McCabe? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What time did McCabe go to work there usually?
A. Well, every two weeks he used to open up in the morning. Q. What time would he quit in the evening?
A. He would quit in the evening at seven o'clock.
Q. What time did the defendant at the bar go to work there? A. He came to work at seven.
Q. In the evening? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Quit the next morning? A. No, sir.
Q. When?
A. It would be the next morning. I would not be in
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that shop then.
Q. What time would you be in the shop? A. I was there at night.
Q. You have never stayed out as late as that? A. I have stayed out but not there.
Q. How much of your time wore you in that store inside? A. Well, most of the time I was inside.
Q. What were you doing in there most of the time? A. Cleaning.
Q. When would you go in there to clean?
A. Say about half past five or six o'clock in the morning. Q. How much time would you be in there?
A. Well I would probably be in there all day. Q. Cleaning all day?
A. All day. I would be out sometimes.
Q. But you were inside most of the time? A. Mostly.
Q. Who would look out for your boot-black stand on the outside? A. There wouldn't be anybody looking after it.
Q. When did Donnelly come to work there usually? A. Usually?
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Q. Yes.
A. As I said before, every two weeks they changed off.
Q. Seven o'clock in the morning Donnelly would come and quit at seven in the evening? A. No sir; he came at five o'clock in the morning?
Q. And got through when? A. Seven.
Q. You have been very friendly with Donnelly all the while? A. I can not say anything against him.
Q. You are friendly with his brother Patrick, aren't you? A. Well, yes.
Q. And you have talked with Felix Donnelly about this case, too? A. I have not.
Q. Not a word? A. No, sir.
Q. Have you got any money to come down here and testify? A. Money?
Q. Yes.
A. I haven't so very much.
Q. Have you received any money?
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A. No, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Has anybody given you any money?
A. No, sir, Nobody has given me any money. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Haven't you since the 28th day of May down to the commencement of this trial been taken care of by
Donnelly? A. No, sir.
Q. You have gone to him from time to time to get money? A. No sir--never have.
Q. Haven't you conversed with them on this subject? A. No, sir.
Q. Where do you reside now? A. 210 West 29th Street.
Q. Are you still working for Donnelly? A. No, sir.
Q. What did you leave there for? A. Well I was sick when I left.
Q. When?
A. About three weeks before Christmas. Q. When he discharged you?
A. I was not discharged. I was sick. Q. What are you doing now?
A. Driving for the street cleaning department.
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Q. How long have you been there?
A. I have been there, about, I guess, four or five weeks. Q. Who appointed you?
A. I am not appointed. I am extra man.
Q. Who had you made extra man in the street cleaning department? Objected to.
A. Mr. Wood.
Q. Who is Mr. Wood?
A. The foreman of the stable.
Q. Who wont to see Mr. Wood in your interest? A. No one.
Q. Did you go to Mr. Wood and ask him for the appointment? A. No, sir,
Q. Mr. Wood sent for you? A. No, sir.
Q. Will you tell us how you got the job? A. I went and asked for the job.
Q. I asked you that a moment ago.
A. You said appointed. I never asked for the appointment.
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BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you ask Wood to give you the job? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Wood put you on as extra man? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Henry Johnson was a colored man, wasn't he? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And a friend of yours? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you were ***oasociated with him very much? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You became very much embittered against Madden when you heard that Madden had hurt your friend Johnson, didn't you?
A. No sir; I didn't go so much against him but I hadn't anything to do with him. Q. Just look at that and see if that is your signature?
(Showing paper.) A. Yes, sir.
Q. You*** signed that? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you swore to this paper, didn't you? A. I did.
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BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you ask Wood to give you the job? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Wood put you on as extra man? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Henry Johnson was a colored man, wasn't he? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And a friend of yours? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you were ***oasociated with him very much? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You became very much embittered against Madden when you heard that Madden had hurt your friend Johnson, didn't you?
A. No sir; I didn't go so much against him but I hadn't anything to do with him. Q. Just look at that and see if that is your signature?
(Showing paper.) A. Yes, sir.
Q. You*** signed that? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you swore to this paper, didn't you? A. I did.
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Q. Now, did you state that you and Madden were very friendly up to the time that Madden had the difficulty with your friend Johnson?
A. I was friendly-- BY THE COURT:
Q. No, no. Did you make that statement in that paper? A. I didn't say friendly. I knew him.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Let me see if you said this: "I heard that he had a fight with a friend of mine, Henry Johnson, of 253 West
28th Street. Madden and I were friendly up to the time of the light with my friend and after that I had no more to do with him." Did you say that?
A. N***o, Madden-- BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you say that ***in that paper? A. Well, we were friendly.
Q. Did you say that in that paper? By MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You swore to that in the paper? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did Johnson the man who was hurt live with you? A. At one time he did.
Q. Where?
239
Q. Now, did you state that you and Madden were very friendly up to the time that Madden had the difficulty with your friend Johnson?
A. I was friendly-- BY THE COURT:
Q. No, no. Did you make that statement in that paper? A. I didn't say friendly. I knew him.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Let me see if you said this: "I heard that he had a fight with a friend of mine, Henry Johnson, of 253 West
28th Street. Madden and I were friendly up to the time of the light with my friend and after that I had no more to do with him." Did you say that?
A. N***o, Madden-- BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you say that ***in that paper? A. Well, we were friendly.
Q. Did you say that in that paper? By MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You swore to that in the paper? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did Johnson the man who was hurt live with you? A. At one time he did.
Q. Where?
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A. In 25th Street.
Q. Is that the place they call the Black Chapel? A. No, sir.
Q. Did he occupy a roam there with you? A. He did.
Q. Have you a family? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where is your family? A. 210 West 29th Street.
Q. Where you reside now? Q. Yes, sir.
Q. You remember testifying at the Coroner's inquest, don't you? A. I recollect.
BY THE COURT:
Q. You gave your statement there? A. I did.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You recollect being sent for to come down to the District Attorney's office to give your narrative concerning this case, don't you?
A. The District Attorney's office? Q. Yes.
A. I recollect.
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Q. You were in the office of the District Attorney in this ***buiding? A. No, sir.
Q. You were not down stairs? A. No, sir.
Q. Do you remember seeing this gentleman, Mr. Martine? A. I do.
Q. Where did you see him?
A. I don't think it was down stairs I seen him. BY THE COURT:
Q. Where was it?
A. I believe it was down stairs now, yes. BY ***MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Why was it you didn't remember a moment ***ago it was down stairs when you could remember about throwing the cusp***ador?
A. I know I remember seeing him. BY THE COURT:
Q. Then you saw him down stairs?
A. I couldn't say whether it was in this building or it was in. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You can't tell ***that? A. No, sir.
Q. How did you come down here.
A. I went by the number that was ***on the paper. I don't know whether it was this building or some other building.
241
Q. You were in the office of the District Attorney in this ***buiding? A. No, sir.
Q. You were not down stairs? A. No, sir.
Q. Do you remember seeing this gentleman, Mr. Martine? A. I do.
Q. Where did you see him?
A. I don't think it was down stairs I seen him. BY THE COURT:
Q. Where was it?
A. I believe it was down stairs now, yes. BY ***MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Why was it you didn't remember a moment ***ago it was down stairs when you could remember about throwing the cusp***ador?
A. I know I remember seeing him. BY THE COURT:
Q. Then you saw him down stairs?
A. I couldn't say whether it was in this building or it was in. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You can't tell ***that? A. No, sir.
Q. How did you come down here.
A. I went by the number that was ***on the paper. I don't know whether it was this building or some other building.
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Q. How did you come down here to-day? A. By this number.
Q. Who brought you down? A. I brought myself down.
Q. Did anyone come with you?
A. There was some more came the same as I. Q. Who were they?
A. Johnson and a man named Henry Tucker.
Q. Tucker and Johnson, the man that was hurt, your friend came here this morning? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where were you about nine o'clock? A. I was at home.
Q. Weren't you on the corner of Eighth Avenue and 28th Street? A. I was not.
Q. At this store, weren't you? A. No, sir.
Q. When you came down to see Mr. Martine to tell him, about what occurred in the saloon used and occupied by
Felix Donnelly, why didn't you tell him, the public prosecutor, that at one time you saw a cusp***ador in the
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hands of Madden and that ha threatened to brain the defendant at the bar? Why didn't you tell us that then? A. Well, I did not think it was necessary.
Q. You didn't think there was anything in that at all at that time, did you? A. Well, I knew I would have to tell it.
Q. You didn't tell the public prosecutor anything about it? A. I didn't tell him.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Why didn't you tell Mr. Martine when you were talking to him and when he was taking your statement that you saw the deadman take up this cusp***ador and say to the defendant, in substance, that he would brain the defendant?
A. The reason I didn't tell him was--I knew it but I didn't-- BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Why didn't you? That is what we want to know. A. Well, I had no particular reason.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Is that the best answer you can give? A. For not telling him.
Q. Did you tell Mr. Martine, the Assistant District Attorney, that you heard the desceased man say, "I will do you still-worse than I did the colored man?"
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you tell that to Mr. Martine? A. I did.
Q. (By Mr. McIntyre.) Is it not a fact, Butler, that the conversation that you have narrated hereto-day as
having occurred in Donnelly's saloon at one time, namely, that you heard Madden say that he would take the cusp***ador and brain the defendant with it--is it not a fact that those words have been recently put in your mouth?
A. No, sir, I was in the saloon at the time.
Q. You knew when you called on Mr. Martine that we were going to try this defendant at the bar for his life and you did not regard that as of sufficient importance to communicate that fact to us?
A. I knew it but I did not say anything about it. This was not put in my mouth because I seen it with my own eyes.
Q. You testified before the Coroner in behalf of this defendant? A. Well, I stated the truth.
Q. You testified before the Coroner for this defendant at the bar? A. I did.
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Q. You went down with a view to establish the defense of self defense before the coroner? Objected to. Question not pressed.
Q. Why didn't you tell the Coroner or the Coroner's Jury that at one time you saw Madden take a cusp***ador and threatened to brain the defendant with it?
A. Because I forgot that part of it. Q. You forgot it?
A. Probably I did.
Q. You know that the coroner's inquest was held on the 21st. day of June about one month after the shooting--less than one month after the shooting-- and at that time, a little more than three weeks after the
28th day of May you had forgotten all about the cusp***ador episode? A. It went out of my mind.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you tell the Coroner when you were before the Coroner what you remembered about the cusp***ador? A. I did not.
Q. Why didn't you tell the Coroner?
A. It was in my mind, I forgot about it. Q. Is that all you can say?
A. That is all I can say about that.
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Q. You went down with a view to establish the defense of self defense before the coroner? Objected to. Question not pressed.
Q. Why didn't you tell the Coroner or the Coroner's Jury that at one time you saw Madden take a cusp***ador and threatened to brain the defendant with it?
A. Because I forgot that part of it. Q. You forgot it?
A. Probably I did.
Q. You know that the coroner's inquest was held on the 21st. day of June about one month after the shooting--less than one month after the shooting-- and at that time, a little more than three weeks after the
28th day of May you had forgotten all about the cusp***ador episode? A. It went out of my mind.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you tell the Coroner when you were before the Coroner what you remembered about the cusp***ador? A. I did not.
Q. Why didn't you tell the Coroner?
A. It was in my mind, I forgot about it. Q. Is that all you can say?
A. That is all I can say about that.
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Q. Did you tell the Coroner that this deceased man came that of the saloon and said, "I will do you a damned sight worse than I did the colored man?"
A. I did.
Q. You told him that? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Now, Butler, you said that you heard Madden ***come outside and say, "I will do you a damned sight worse than I did the coon?"
A. Yes, sir.
Q. You heard him say that? A. Yes, Sir.
Q. Were you standing by your boot-black stand? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Were you near your boot-black chair? A. I was, yes.
Q. That was on the corner? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was Donnelly inside? A. He were.
Q. Could you see him from where you stood? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Standing by the boot-black chair?
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Q. Did you tell the Coroner that this deceased man came that of the saloon and said, "I will do you a damned sight worse than I did the colored man?"
A. I did.
Q. You told him that? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Now, Butler, you said that you heard Madden ***come outside and say, "I will do you a damned sight worse than I did the coon?"
A. Yes, sir.
Q. You heard him say that? A. Yes, Sir.
Q. Were you standing by your boot-black stand? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Were you near your boot-black chair? A. I was, yes.
Q. That was on the corner? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was Donnelly inside? A. He were.
Q. Could you see him from where you stood? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Standing by the boot-black chair?
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A. I was standing right at the corner of the window. Q. Was Donnelly behind the par?
A. He were.
Q. Were the doors closed or open?
A. One of them opened and the other closed.
Q. You couldn't see from the boot-black stand into the saloon? A. Well, I was standing just ***insdie when the door was open. Q. You said a moment ago that you were outside.
A. At my boot-black chair.
Q. That was on the extreme corner? A. No sir, not the extreme corner.
Q. Where was it?
A. Between the corner and the door.
Q. Could you see in the middle of the window? A. Yes, about the middle of the window.
Q. And standing by that boot-black stand you could look in? A. Yes, by the door.
Q. You could look in a northerly direction and then turn your eye through the door way and see the defendant at this Bar behind the bar?
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A. I was standing right at the corner of the window. Q. Was Donnelly behind the par?
A. He were.
Q. Were the doors closed or open?
A. One of them opened and the other closed.
Q. You couldn't see from the boot-black stand into the saloon? A. Well, I was standing just ***insdie when the door was open. Q. You said a moment ago that you were outside.
A. At my boot-black chair.
Q. That was on the extreme corner? A. No sir, not the extreme corner.
Q. Where was it?
A. Between the corner and the door.
Q. Could you see in the middle of the window? A. Yes, about the middle of the window.
Q. And standing by that boot-black stand you could look in? A. Yes, by the door.
Q. You could look in a northerly direction and then turn your eye through the door way and see the defendant at this Bar behind the bar?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you hear any quarrel inside? A. Between them two?
Q. Yes.
A. I didn't hear any quarreling. Q. You heard no words?
A. I heard the words when I seen him. Q. When he cane to the door?
A. When he came to the door.
Q. How did you know he addressed those words to Donnelly? A. Because I did not see anyone else.
Q. Did you see anyone else in the store that day? A. I did not.
Q. And you know that those words were addressed to Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did Donnelly say anything?
A. He didn't say anything to him at all.
Q. Did Donnelly have a pistol in his hand? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you ever see Donnelly have a pistol in that store or did you ever See pistol in that store?
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A. I have. Q. Where?
A. In the drawer.
Q. In what drawer? A. Behind the bar.
Q. The centre drawer?
A. No, it is not exactly the centre. It was only one--
Q. Now, you say that the dead man was a quarrelsome man? A. He were.
Q. How many times did you ever see him in his lifetime?
A. I have seen him quite often. I used to see him about twice a day. Q. Do you know what he worked at?
A. He was a truck driver. Q. He worked for, whom?
A. That is more than I am able to say. Q. He was engaged driving a truck? A. Yes, sir.
Q. He must have been at work during the day time? A. He couldn't have been every day.
Q. You say you saw him twice a day?
A. Once in a while--when he went in there.
Q. What makes you believe he was a quarrelsome man?
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A. By his conduct.
Q. What conduct did you see to indicate he was a quarrelsome man. What did you see him do? A. He was around trying to pick a quarrel--
Q. Give the name or the person--who with? A. Tucker.
Q. What does Tucker do?
A. He is in the street cleaning department. Q.
A colored man, too?
A. Yes.
Q. What difficulty did he have?
A. Tucker came in one afternoon and asked for a drink when Madden was there. He said, "I wont drink at a bar with a God damned coon,"*** and struck him.
Q. Madden did that? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did Tucker ask for a drink? A. Asked the bartender.
Q. Madden was standing right there? A. He was standing at the right.
Q. Did he ask Madden to drink with him? A. No.
Q. Why should Madden have said he would not drink with
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a coon?
A. I don't know.
Q. Tucker didn't ask him to drink? A. No.
Q. Madden didn't ask him to drink? A. No.
Q. And the bartender didn't ask either of them to drink? A. No, sir.
Q. You want the Court and Jury to understand that Madden said he would not drink with a coon? A. "I wont drink at a bar with a coon."
Q. How big a man was Madden? A. He was a good sized man.
Q. Wasn't he a small man? A. No, sir.
Q. How big a man was Tucker?
A. Tucker is a good built man but he isn't very tall. Q. And he knocked Tucker down?
A. Yes sir.
Q. What did Tucker do?
A. Tucker didn't do anything. Q. Nothing?
A. Didn't raise his hand.
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Q. Do you mean to say that this man called him a coon and then knocked him down and Tucker didn't do anything?
A. He didn't do anything when he knocked him down and I caught hold of Madden. Q. Did you strike Madden?
A. No, Sir.
Q. When he struck your friend for nothing? A. No, sir.
Q. And when he insulted your race you didn't do anything? A. No. I didn't hit him.
Q. You ***want that to go upon the record that this man knocked Tucker down? A. He did.
Q. And that your friend Tucker did not retort? A. No sir; he didn't.
Q. What other quarreling did you see him have?
A. Well I seen him quarreling previously to that with the Johnson man. Q. Another quarrel with Johnson?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. After he cut Johnson? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. Where?
A. On the corner. Q. What corner?
A. 28th Street and Eighth Avenue. Q. What did he say to Johnson?
A. I wasn't there when it first started and I came out-side and there was a quarrel. I don't know what said because Johnson can tell it himself. Johnson told him to ***go away and leave him. I don't know what he said but any-how Johnson came back to the stand.
Q. This place of Donnelly's a great many of your race frequent--a great many colored people? A. Not over the average.
Q. Well, a great many?
A. Well the people around that district, yes.
Q. More colored people come in there than white? A. I can not say.
Q. Well, there is a good many that come in there? A. Yes, a good many.
Q.
A great many colored people? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, did you ever have any trouble with Madden?
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Q. Where?
A. On the corner. Q. What corner?
A. 28th Street and Eighth Avenue. Q. What did he say to Johnson?
A. I wasn't there when it first started and I came out-side and there was a quarrel. I don't know what said because Johnson can tell it himself. Johnson told him to ***go away and leave him. I don't know what he said but any-how Johnson came back to the stand.
Q. This place of Donnelly's a great many of your race frequent--a great many colored people? A. Not over the average.
Q. Well, a great many?
A. Well the people around that district, yes.
Q. More colored people come in there than white? A. I can not say.
Q. Well, there is a good many that come in there? A. Yes, a good many.
Q.
A great many colored people? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, did you ever have any trouble with Madden?
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A. Well I can't say as I ever had any trouble because lots of times probably I would have-- BY THE COURT:
Q. No, did you have any trouble with him? A. No, sir, not to shoot people.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Did you ever have any wordy altercation with him--any words? A. I didn't have any words.
Q. When you came down to the District Attorney's office to see Mr. Martine why didn't you tell us about the
trouble that you had had with Madden and why didn't you tell us about the second assault upon Johnson and why didn't you tell us about the trouble that Tucker had had?
A. Because you didn't ask me. Q. Who asked you since then? A. You are asking me now.
Q. Mr. House asked you a little while ago? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now you told Mr. House that you knew all these things about Madden? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where?
A. At his office.
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Q. You went over to his office? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Who brought you to his office? A. I took myself down.
Q. Who told you where his office was? A. Nobody didn't tell me.
Q. Nobody told you where Mr. House's office was? A. No.
Q. You went and found it yourself? A. I went by myself.
Q. Where is his office? A. In the World building.
Q. Yes, that is right. Now, somebody told you that his office was in the World building. Who was it? A. I don't know.
Q. You can't tell who it was? A. No.
Q. Who asked you to go down and see Mr. House? A. I went to see him myself.
Q. What for?
A. On some business.
Q. What kind of business--in connection with this case? A. No, sir.
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Q. Some other business? A. Yes, sir.
Q. It was in connection with some other business that you commenced to tell him what you knew about this case?
A. That is the way it commenced.
Q. You did not know that you were going to be a witness in this case at the time you went to see Mr. House? A. No sir; I did not know whether I would be in it at all.
Q. I am not going to ask you what the nature of the business was that you had with Mr. House. Who told you where Mr. House's office was?
A No one told me.
Q. How did you commence to tell Mr. House what you knew about Madden?
A. For the reason because we were talking and he wanted to know if I was the sane Butler that was at the
Coroners office and I told him I was.
Q. He saw you at the Coroner's office? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then for the first time you told Mr. House about the***se threats? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. Some other business? A. Yes, sir.
Q. It was in connection with some other business that you commenced to tell him what you knew about this case? A. That is the way it commenced.
Q. You did not know that you were going to be a witness in this case at the time you went to see Mr. House? A. No sir; I did not know whether I would be in it at all.
Q. I am not going to ask you what the nature of the business was that you had with Mr. House. Who told you where Mr. House's office was?
A No one told me.
Q. How did you commence to tell Mr. House what you knew about Madden?
A. For the reason because we were talking and he wanted to know if I was the sane Butler that was at the
Coroners office and I told him I was.
Q. He saw you at the Coroner's office? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then for the first time you told Mr. House about the***se threats? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. And you had never told a soul on earth about them before? A.
A soul on earth?
Q. Yes.
A. Not outside of the Coroner's office.
Q. You didn't say anything in the Coroner's office? You told me you didn't say anything? A. Not about the cusp***ador.
Q. You never told anything about that? A. No sir; I didn't.
Q. Now, have you spoken to a single friend of the defend ant at the bar since the 28th day of May? A. Have I spoken to anyone?
Q. Yes.
A. I can say I have.
Q. Who did you speak to? A. But not about the--
Q. Who did you speak to? A. I spoke to Mr. Donnelly. Q. Which Mr. Donnelly?
A. Felix Donnelly.
Q. The employer of this man at the bar? A. Yes, and I spoke to Mr. Pat Donnelly.
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Q. That is his brother?
A. Because I know them all.
Q. When ***did you talk ***to Mr. Patrick Donnelly and Felix Donnelly did you tell them what you knew about
Madden?
A. No sir because the business was something else. Q. (By the Court.) Did you or not?
A. I did not.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You did not think it was of sufficient importance to talk about? A. No.
Q. And the first occasion when you ever said a word about the things you would testify to was when you saw Mr. House in his office in the World building?
A. I did.
Q. Who brought you down to the Coroner's inquest? A. I brought myself. I was subpoenaed.
Q. Did anybody talk ***to you about the testimony on you were going to give them? A. No, sir.
Q. You did not talk to Mr. Friend, Mr. House's partner? A. No, sir.
Q. You did not talk with Mr. House then? A. I did not.
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Q. That is his brother?
A. Because I know them all.
Q. When ***did you talk ***to Mr. Patrick Donnelly and Felix Donnelly did you tell them what you knew about
Madden?
A. No sir because the business was something else. Q. (By the Court.) Did you or not?
A. I did not.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You did not think it was of sufficient importance to talk about? A. No.
Q. And the first occasion when you ever said a word about the things you would testify to was when you saw Mr. House in his office in the World building?
A. I did.
Q. Who brought you down to the Coroner's inquest? A. I brought myself. I was subpoenaed.
Q. Did anybody talk ***to you about the testimony on you were going to give them? A. No, sir.
Q. You did not talk to Mr. Friend, Mr. House's partner? A. No, sir.
Q. You did not talk with Mr. House then? A. I did not.
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Q. Mr. House put you on the stand without knowing what you were going to testify to? A. That is what he did.
MR. McINTYRE: Oh.
MR. HOUSE: That is it, because he was subpoenaed by the District Attorney and as they didn't call him I put him on for that reason.
THE COURT: There is no occasion to say anything more on that subject. Q. Did you ever live in Goat Alley?
A. I did.
Q. Where is that? A. In Washington.
Q. Did you ever work for a Dr. Walsh? A. Yes.
Q. How long,
A. Eighteen months, as near as I can remember it.
Q. Now, do you remember a man by the name of ***Jim Butts? A. I do.
Q. That was the man you referred to a moment ago when you were arrested? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, when you were arrested at that time for fighting
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Q. Mr. House put you on the stand without knowing what you were going to testify to? A. That is what he did.
MR. McINTYRE: Oh.
MR. HOUSE: That is it, because he was subpoenaed by the District Attorney and as they didn't call him I put him on for that reason.
THE COURT: There is no occasion to say anything more on that subject. Q. Did you ever live in Goat Alley?
A. I did.
Q. Where is that? A. In Washington.
Q. Did you ever work for a Dr. Walsh? A. Yes.
Q. How long,
A. Eighteen months, as near as I can remember it.
Q. Now, do you remember a man by the name of ***Jim Butts? A. I do.
Q. That was the man you referred to a moment ago when you were arrested? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, when you were arrested at that time for fighting
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with Butts Donnelly went bail for you, didn't he? A. No, Sir.
Q. Do you remember testifying to this before the Coroner? "Have you ever been arrested? Once in my life. For what? ***Fighting. With whom? Supposed to be fighting.***" You said you were fighting?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. With whom?
A.
A fellow by the name of Jim Butts. Q. Where?
A. Corner of 28th Street.
Q. And Mr. Donnelly went bail for you? A. No, sir.
Q. You say he didn't? A. No.
RE-DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now Mr. Butler in all of these questions that were asked of you in regard to your past live by the
Assistant District Attorney id you answer truthfully? A. I have.
Q. You never have been convicted for the commission of any crime, have you? THE COURT: You need not answer that. (To Mr.
260
with Butts Donnelly went bail for you, didn't he? A. No, Sir.
Q. Do you remember testifying to this before the Coroner? "Have you ever been arrested? Once in my life. For what? ***Fighting. With whom? Supposed to be fighting.***" You said you were fighting?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. With whom?
A.
A fellow by the name of Jim Butts. Q. Where?
A. Corner of 28th Street.
Q. And Mr. Donnelly went bail for you? A. No, sir.
Q. You say he didn't? A. No.
RE-DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now Mr. Butler in all of these questions that were asked of you in regard to your past live by the
Assistant District Attorney id you answer truthfully? A. I have.
Q. You never have been convicted for the commission of any crime, have you? THE COURT: You need not answer that. (To Mr.
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House.) He has already said he had not been.
Q. Since you have been old enough have you always ***worked and suppo***rted yourself? A. I have.
Q. You have never depended upon the charity or the benevolence of any one? A. I have not.
Q. Whatever you have got you have earned it? A. I always meant to
Q. Now, Mr. Butler you say that you were a porter for Felix Donnelly at this saloon on the corner of Eighth
Avenue and 28th Street for a period of a little over three years? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And during that time you frequently came in contact with this defendant? A. I did.
Q. You saw him there when he was about in the day time? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you saw him there at night time? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You have seen him there when other people were in the saloon?
261
House.) He has already said he had not been.
Q. Since you have been old enough have you always ***worked and suppo***rted yourself? A. I have.
Q. You have never depended upon the charity or the benevolence of any one? A. I have not.
Q. Whatever you have got you have earned it? A. I always meant to
Q. Now, Mr. Butler you say that you were a porter for Felix Donnelly at this saloon on the corner of Eighth
Avenue and 28th Street for a period of a little over three years? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And during that time you frequently came in contact with this defendant? A. I did.
Q. You saw him there when he was about in the day time? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you saw him there at night time? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You have seen him there when other people were in the saloon?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you think during those three years you have known other people who have seen him the same as you have? A. Yes, sir.
Q. During that time what has been his character for peace and quietness? A. As far as I know he has been a very peaceable and quiet man.
THE COURT: I thought you had got to the end of that line? You said you would be satisfied with two more witnesses if I would allow you and now you give me the third.
MR. HOUSE: I didn't mean to call him just exactly as to character.
Q. Now, Mr. Butler, some questions have been put to you by the District Attorney regarding the quarrels that you have seen Madden in. He asked you if Madden ever quarreled with you and you were about to answer and stopped. Now tell us why it was that Madden never en gaped in any fight or quarrel with you?
A. Because I would always be sent away. Q. Who would send you ***away?
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A. Mr. Donnelly. He would say tome there was go in to be a fuss and he said, "It is best for you to go home." BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. When did he tell you to go home? Give me one night?
A. At night.
Q. Of course, you wouldn't stay there at night?
A. Saturday night I would stay until the store closed. Q. And Madden was in the place very frequently?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you never saw an occasion when it was necessary to bring an officer and arrest Madden for disorderly conduct?
A. I never saw it myself. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now--
THE COURT: We have had a direct examination, a cross examination a re-direct examination and another cross examination. How long is this going to last?
MR. HOUSE: This is something that I did not think of that was brought out by the other side. THE COURT: Ask it.
Q. Now, After, as you have told, Madden knocked your friend Tucker down did Madden attempt to do anything to
Tucker after he was down on the floor of the saloon?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. What did he do?
A. He tried to jump on him.
Q. Who if anybody prevented him? A. I did.
Q. The Court: We have got all that, Mr. House. Mr. House: Just one other question.
THE COURT: Don't answer until I tell you.
A. After Tucker left the saloon did you see where Madden went? A. No, sir, I did not.
BY THE FOREMAN:
Q. You heard Madden threaten to make a corpse of Mr. Donnelly? A. I did.
Q. Did you tell Mr. Martine that? A. I did.
Q. Did you tell that at the Coroner's inquest? A. I did.
HENRY TUCKER, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Whereabouts do you give Mr Tucker?
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A. I live in 228--me and Mr. Madden as first-- BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Let us know where you are living now. A. I am living at 210 West 29th Street.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. What are you employed at?
A. In the Street Cleaning Department. Q. Driving a wagon?
A. Driving a cart.
Q. How long have you been employed in that work? A. Going on two years.
Q. Did you know Madden in his lifetime, Mr. Tucker? A. No sir, not before he made a fuss at me.
Q. Did you ever meet him in Donnelly's saloon at the corner of 28th Street and Eighth Avenue?
A. I met him that night when he made the disturbance with me. That is the first time I ever met him. Q. What time was it that you went into the saloon, Mr. Tucker?
A. It was at night.
Q. Did you go in there with anyone or alone? A. I went by my loneself.
Q. What did you go in for? A. To get a drink.
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Q. Who was behind the bar, if you know?
A.
A man by the name of Tom, I don't know his other name. Q. Did you see Madden in the saloon?
A. No sir; I didn't know the man. BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you see Madden in there that night? A. I seen him there that night.
Q. The night that you went in there to get the drink was Madden in there? A. I didn't know who he ***was.
Q. Answer my question. You went in the Saloon one evening, you say, and had a drink and the man behind the bar was who?
A. Tom.
Q. Did you see Madden in there that night? A. I seen as me other men.
Q. Did you see Madden? A. I didn't know him.
BY MR. HOUSE: Q. At that time? A. No, sir.
Q. After that night did you find out that one of the men that you saw in there was Madden?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. The fellow that is alleged to have been killed on Sunday, May 28th? A. Yes. I found his name was Madden.
Q. When you went in and asked for your drink did you say anything to this man Madden? A. No, Sir.
Q. What was it that happened?
A. After I asked for my drink--I asked for my drink and he came to say that he would not take a drink at a bar with a nigger and with the next word out of his mouth he knocked me down. I hadn't spoken to the man. He hit me and knocked me down in the gutter after he followed me out and kicked me when I was lying in the gutter.
Q. Now, Mr. Tucker, before *** striking you and knocking you down had you said anything to him? A. Not anything at all.
Q. Did you give him any cause or any reason for assaulting you in that way? A. Not any cause in the world, sir.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE: Q. Now, Tucker, you know Butler pretty well? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. You have talked about this, Butler and you, haven't you?
A. No, I have not said anything more about the case to him any more than that I was talking about who this man was that hurt me. This man was Madden.
Q. You live with Butler, don't you? A. Yes, right in his house now.
Q. You board with him?
A. Yes, board right there with him now.
Q. Did you tell him last night you were subpoenaed to come down here? A. Certainly I told him.
Q. You were subpoenaed the other day? A. Yes. I was here the other day.
Q. And you saw Butler down here? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you talk with Butler in the Court Room about this case? A. No, sir.
Q. Did Butler tell you what you were going to testify to? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you tell Butler what you were going to testify to?
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A. No, sir.
Q. Has Butler told you what he was going to testify to? A. No, sir.
Q. You never talked about this case? A. No, sir.
Q. You have come down here for three separate distinct days and you two have never talked about this case? A. Never said a word.
No sir, because I didn't know what we would testify to. Q. Didn't you know what you were going to testify to? A. Something was said--
Q. I want to know whether you knew what you were going to testify about, whether you know you were going to testify about Madden here?
A. Outside the door?
Q. You knew what you were going to testify about, didn't you? A. Certainly I knew.
Q. You knew the questions Mr. House was going to ask you, didn't you? A. I didn't know the questions he was going to ask.
Q. Tucker, when you went upon the stand before a
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single question was asked you concerning anything you blurted out about an assault that you said was committed on you by Madden. How did you know that was what was wanted here?
A. How did I know? I should think you people would want that here, in this business here--the truth and the light.
Q. Have you talked with Mr. House about this case? A. No, sir; I don't know the man if I saw him.
Q. You never saw Mr. House? A. No, sir.
Q. You don't know him? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you see Mr. Donnelly? A. Yes, I know Mr. Donnelly. Q. The defendant at the bar? A. Sir?
Q. This man that we are trying. Did you see him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And talked to him about the case? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you see his brother?
A. I seen his brother and I didn't talk to his brother.
271 & 272
Q. You never said a word to his brother? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you see his uncle, Mr. Felix Donnelly? A. Yes, I have.
Q. Did you talk with him about it? A. No, sir, I didn't.
Q. Did you ever tell anybody about the assault? A. No sir.
Q. Will you tell me then how it was that you came down here? A. Because you sent for me and I had to come.
Q. Who ***sent for you?
A. Some of you gentlemen down here in this business. I am telling the truth.
Q. Do you mean to say that none of the Donnellys have come to see you to ask you to come here and testify to the assault that was committed on you?
A. No, sir. None of the Donnellys came. Some man came. I didn't know the man. Donnelly's bartender come. I
don't know his name. He came with the paper. Q. What did that bartender say to you?
A. He told me to come down here. That is all he said to me.
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Q. You never said a word to his brother? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you see his uncle, Mr. Felix Donnelly? A. Yes, I have.
Q. Did you talk with him about it? A. No, sir, I didn't.
Q. Did you ever tell anybody about the assault? A. No sir.
Q. Will you tell me then how it was that you came down here? A. Because you sent for me and I had to come.
Q. Who ***sent for you?
A. Some of you gentlemen down here in this business. I am telling the truth.
Q. Do you mean to say that none of the Donnellys have come to see you to ask you to come here and testify to the assault that was committed on you?
A. No, sir. None of the Donnellys came. Some man came. I didn't know the man. Donnelly's bartender come. I
don't know his name. He came with the paper. Q. What did that bartender say to you?
A. He told me to come down here. That is all he said to me.
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Q. Did you read the note?
A. I didn't read it. I looked at it. I see where I had to come, because I knew the numbers but I couldn't read.
Q. You say that nobody has spoken to you about this case? A. No, sir.
Q. And you didn't tell anybody about Madden and about the assault perp***etrated upon you? A. No, sir.
Q. What had you been working at before you went in to the Street Cleaning Department? A. I was working at the Mail stable in 28th Street.
Q. Who put you in the Street Cleaning Department?
A. Well I got there by working down at the time of winter--last winter in the deep snow there was an advertisement for a lot of drivers and I thought I would go down there and see if I couldn't get a place.
Q. Have you been at work there ever since? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What did you work at before that? A. Before I was in the stable?
Q. Yes.
A. I was at work on the water--works.
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Q. Where?
A. For Paige & Carey.
Q. (By the Court.) Where are they?
A. The water-works are what they call this new ***aqueduct. That is what they call the water-works. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Where did you work before that? A. Where did I work before that?
Q. Yes.
A. Before I went on the water-works? Q. Yes.
A. I worked in Virginia.
Q. You came from Virginia too? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You have worked in gambling houses? A. Sir? Gambling houses?
Q. Yes.
A. No sir. I never gambled in my life. Q. That?
A. Never gambled in my life.
Q. Haven't you played poker in Donnelly's store? A. No, sir.
Q. Don't you play policy? A. Never.
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Q. Never? A. No, sir.
Q. Let us come to the assualt in this case? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What time or day was it?
A. What time do you mean when Madden made the assault? A. It was at night.
Q. What time?
A. I couldn't tell you at what hour. It was soon after I came from my work and I came from 12th Street. Q. Had you be ***an drinking?
A. No, sir.
Q. Were you sober?
A. Just as sober as I am now, sir. Q. Are you sure?
A. I don't think I had anything to drink at all any more than calling for that drink. The first thing I
***knew Butler--
Q. Where was Butler?
A. He was in there behind the oar cleaning up there. Q. What did you ask for?
A. I asked for a drink.
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Q. What sort of a drink, beer? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where was Madden standing? A. He was standing by the bar.
Q. Did you ask Madden to have a drink? A. No sir.
Q. Did Madden ask you to have a drink? A. No, sir.
Q. Did the bartender ask either of you to have a drink? A. No, sir.
Q. You never saw Madden before? A. Never in my life.
Q. And Madden then said what?
Q. He said he would not drink at a bar with a nigger. Q. What did you do?
A. I didn't do anything. Q. What did he do?
A. He knocked me down,
A. As soon as he got the words out of his mouth he knocked me down on the floor. He pounded me. This man
Butler stopped him. Butler was inside the door. Then after I got out he knocked me down in the gutter and
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kicked me.
Q. Where was Butler?
A. I suppose he was inside. Q. Did you strike back?
A. No, sir.
Q. You permitted him to knock you down? A. Why, certainly.
Q. Didn't you get up?
A. I couldn't help myself.
Q. You and he went outside and he knocked you in the gutter and you didn't do anything? A. No.
Q. You didn't try to defend***a yourself? A. No sir; I didn't.
Q. Why?
A. Because he knocked me down unknown to myself as I was going outside of the door. Q. What did you do when you got up?
A. I got up***and got out of the way the best way I could. Q. Did you see a policeman?
A. No, sir.
Q. You didn't go and make any complaint against him? A. No, sir.
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kicked me.
Q. Where was Butler?
A. I suppose he was inside. Q. Did you strike back?
A. No, sir.
Q. You permitted him to knock you down? A. Why, certainly.
Q. Didn't you get up?
A. I couldn't help myself.
Q. You and he went outside and he knocked you in the gutter and you didn't do anything? A. No.
Q. You didn't try to defend***a yourself? A. No sir; I didn't.
Q. Why?
A. Because he knocked me down unknown to myself as I was going outside of the door. Q. What did you do when you got up?
A. I got up***and got out of the way the best way I could. Q. Did you see a policeman?
A. No, sir.
Q. You didn't go and make any complaint against him? A. No, sir.
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Q. You say that that man knocked you town once in that liquor store and you never said word? A. Never said a word-took it very easy.
Q. He couldn't have hurt you much then?
A. I was laid up for three or four days. I couldn't, hardly walk. My side was all bent and my face was all black.
Q. You just quietly submitted and didn't go to a Police Court and make a complaint? A. No sir; I didn't..
Q. Why didn't you?
A. Well, I didn't know who he was.
Q. How do you know that it was Madden? A. After that I learned it was this man.
Q. How do you know it was?
A. They said this man was the one that done it. BY THE COURT:
Q. What kind of a looking, man was he? A. He was a tall, heavy bodied man.
Q. About how tall?
A.
A great deal taller than I was. Q. About how old?
A. I could not tell because I never saw the man before in my life.
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Q. What kind of hair had he?
A. Kind of sandy-red-not real red but what you call, I think, sandy but not black, I couldn't really tell I
didn't notice it.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. How much have you got to come down here and testify? A. I have got nothing.
Q. You didn't get a cent? A. No, sir.
Q. Who paid your car fare down here this morning? A. I paid my own money.
Q. Has, any money been promised you?
A. No, not a cent. If anybody promised any I don't know anything about it. Q. You don't know anything about that
A. No, sir.
Q. Has anything been said about making you a present? A. No, sir.
Q. You are looking for one?
A. Maybe I would like to get it.
Q. You are expecting something? A. I don't know.
Q. You are expecting something?
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A. I don't know. If I have lost my job I wouldn't like that. If I hadn't come down her then I would be at work but being as I am a poor boy and have no one to help me along-
Q. But you are ***expecting something?
A. I supposed they would do something. I don't know. Q. Who do you expect to get it from?
A. I don't know.
Q. You are expecting something, you don't know from whom you are going to get it?
A. No, sir.
Q. You came down here the last three or four days, did you? A. Yes, the last two days. This makes two days.
Q. You have paid your own car fare? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How much do you get a day?
A. Working in the Street Cleaning, Department, $2 a day. Q. Do you know Mr. Patrick Donnelly?
A. Pat Donnelly, yes.
Q. Do you know Pat Donnelly? Of course you do? A. Of course *** I do.
Q. Do you know Felix Donnelly?
280
A. I don't know. If I have lost my job I wouldn't like that. If I hadn't come down her then I would be at work but being as I am a poor boy and have no one to help me along-
Q. But you are ***expecting something?
A. I supposed they would do something. I don't know. Q. Who do you expect to get it from?
A. I don't know.
Q. You are expecting something, you don't know from whom you are going to get it?
A. No, sir.
Q. You came down here the last three or four days, did you? A. Yes, the last two days. This makes two days.
Q. You have paid your own car fare? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How much do you get a day?
A. Working in the Street Cleaning, Department, $2 a day. Q. Do you know Mr. Patrick Donnelly?
A. Pat Donnelly, yes.
Q. Do you know Pat Donnelly? Of course you do? A. Of course *** I do.
Q. Do you know Felix Donnelly?
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A. Certainly?
Q. Do you know James Donnelly, the defendant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you like him pretty well?
A. I have nothing against him You have known him for a long while? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You would like to help him out of this trouble? A. I would if I knew how.
THOMAS COLEMAN, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. You ar***e a police officer attached to the Police Department of this City? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you be en a police officer? A. Since the fall of 1888.
Q. What precinct are you attached to now? A. The 20th. Precinct.
Q. How long have you be en attached to that precinct? A. Two years and eight months.
Q. So that on the 28th day of May, 1893 and for some time before that you had been attached to the same precinct?
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A. Certainly?
Q. Do you know James Donnelly, the defendant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you like him pretty well?
A. I have nothing against him You have known him for a long while? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You would like to help him out of this trouble? A. I would if I knew how.
THOMAS COLEMAN, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. You ar***e a police officer attached to the Police Department of this City? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you be en a police officer? A. Since the fall of 1888.
Q. What precinct are you attached to now? A. The 20th. Precinct.
Q. How long have you be en attached to that precinct? A. Two years and eight months.
Q. So that on the 28th day of May, 1893 and for some time before that you had been attached to the same precinct?
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A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you know a man named Madden in his lifetime? A. Yes, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Did you know the man that was killed on the 28th day of May last? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Are you acquainted with a colored man named Johnson? A. Yes, I have known him.
Q. Have you seen Johnson frequently?
A. Yes, I have seen him pretty nearly every day for the last two years. Q. Do you know the defendant at the bar Donnelly?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, about three weeks before the shooting of Madden by Donnelly did you see the colored man Johnson? A. Yes, I seen him there every Sunday.
Q. I ask you if two or three weeks before the shooting you saw the colored man Johnson anywhere near the liquor store on 28th Street?
A. I seen him pretty nearly every Sunday. Q. Did you see Madden there?
A. Yes, sir. I was on the corner of 27th Street and
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Johnson came down and said that this man assaulted him- THE COURT: That wont do.
Q. After that did you see Madden?
A. I was on the corner-yes, I saw him. He was under the influence of liquor. Q. What did he say when you saw him?
A. He said he would get square with Johnson. It was Johnson and Donnelly that had put him out. Q. Because Donnelly had put him out on the corner he would get square on both of them?
A. Yes, sir.
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Let us see. You have been a police officer since 1888? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You profess to know your duties as a police officer? A. yes, sir.
Q. Your name is Coleman? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You are the police officer who has been around here corralling witnesses in the Grand. Jury room for the last two or three days?
A. I have been in the grand Jury room.
Q. Did you communicate with the witnesses, the colored
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witnesses, in the Grand Jury room?
A. I had business in the morning here. BYN THE COURT:
Q. Were you in any room in this building with the two colored men who have been witnesses here? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Now, were you talking to those witnesses about this case? A. No, sir.
Q. You were not telling them what to testify to? A. No, sir.
Q. ***You are a friend of Donnelly's? A. No particular friend.
Q. You play poker in his place, don't you? A. I played once there.
Q. And you played poker in his place while you were supposed to be doing your duty there as a police officer? A. No, sir. I played a day when I was off duty.
Q. You visit his place?
A. No sir; very seldom. I live in 27th Street.
Q. Now, I want to know this fact if you have not been daily since this trial commenced in communication with the witnesses for the defendant, including the two colored men who have testified?
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A. Never, never. BY THE COURT:
Q. You said you were in the same room with them. What were you doing in the Grand Jury room? A. I had been subpoenaed.
Q. Why did you go to those two witnesses?
A. They were sitting there. They refused to let me in here. Q. They were in the room?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you say you went into the Grand Jury room? A. Yes,*** sir.
Q. Did you talk to those two colored men? A. No sir; I think not.
Q. Did you talk to them? A. Yes, I did.
Q. Then you did talk to them?
A. Nothing about Donnelly-not a word.
Q. Did you talk to any of the other witnesses? A. Yes, I spoke to One?
Q. Who?
A. Collins and Kiernan. Q. Anyone else?
A. No, sir, not that I know of.
285
A. Never, never. BY THE COURT:
Q. You said you were in the same room with them. What were you doing in the Grand Jury room? A. I had been subpoenaed.
Q. Why did you go to those two witnesses?
A. They were sitting there. They refused to let me in here. Q. They were in the room?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you say you went into the Grand Jury room? A. Yes,*** sir.
Q. Did you talk to those two colored men? A. No sir; I think not.
Q. Did you talk to them? A. Yes, I did.
Q. Then you did talk to them?
A. Nothing about Donnelly-not a word.
Q. Did you talk to any of the other witnesses? A. Yes, I spoke to One?
Q. Who?
A. Collins and Kiernan. Q. Anyone else?
A. No, sir, not that I know of.
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Q. You would know it if you did? It is only a day or two ago officer? A. Not witnesses, I know they were not in the case.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. What time did you go in to the Grand Jury room? A. Half past eleven.
BY THE COURT:
Q. What case in the Grand Jury room were you subpoenaed on? A. Benjamin Butler for malicious mischief.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Not the Butler that testified here to-day? A. No, sir.
Q. What time did you meet the witnesses in the Grand Jury room? A. About two o'clock.
Q. Don't you know as a matter of fact that you had no business yesterday afternoon at 208***cloek with the
Grand Jury for the Grand Jury adjourns at half past one? A. They refused to let me in here and I had no place to go.
Q. Knowing as a police officer that the Grand Jury adjourns at half past one o'clock you were in the Grand
Jury room in company with two colored people and-
286
Q. You would know it if you did? It is only a day or two ago officer? A. Not witnesses, I know they were not in the case.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. What time did you go in to the Grand Jury room? A. Half past eleven.
BY THE COURT:
Q. What case in the Grand Jury room were you subpoenaed on? A. Benjamin Butler for malicious mischief.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Not the Butler that testified here to-day? A. No, sir.
Q. What time did you meet the witnesses in the Grand Jury room? A. About two o'clock.
Q. Don't you know as a matter of fact that you had no business yesterday afternoon at 208***cloek with the
Grand Jury for the Grand Jury adjourns at half past one? A. They refused to let me in here and I had no place to go.
Q. Knowing as a police officer that the Grand Jury adjourns at half past one o'clock you were in the Grand
Jury room in company with two colored people and-
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A. I was reading a paper there.
Q. You saw this colored man Johnson on the corner of 28th Street and Eighth Avenue? A. Yes, sir,
Q. And he informed you then an assault had been perpetrated upon him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. ***Was his face cut?
A. No, sir. He had no murk about him.
Q. When you were told that this man Madden had committed the assault upon him you did not go after Madden to arrest him?
A. He said he threatened him.
Q. You didn't go after Madden to arrest him? A. No.
Q. You made no effort to arres***thim? A. No.
Q. Let me ask you this question. You say that you heard a threat made? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And in view of that threat made wasn't it incumbent upon you as a police officer to apprehend that man? A. He refused to mate a complaint.
287
A. I was reading a paper there.
Q. You saw this colored man Johnson on the corner of 28th Street and Eighth Avenue? A. Yes, sir,
Q. And he informed you then an assault had been perpetrated upon him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. ***Was his face cut?
A. No, sir. He had no murk about him.
Q. When you were told that this man Madden had committed the assault upon him you did not go after Madden to arrest him?
A. He said he threatened him.
Q. You didn't go after Madden to arrest him? A. No.
Q. You made no effort to arres***thim? A. No.
Q. Let me ask you this question. You say that you heard a threat made? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And in view of that threat made wasn't it incumbent upon you as a police officer to apprehend that man? A. He refused to mate a complaint.
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Q. The threat was made?
A. He said he would get square with him.
Q. You made no attempt to prevent any further altercation? A. No.
Q. Besides that you told me he was under the influence of liquor? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And as a police officer of the city of New York why didn't you arrest him for intoxication? A. He wasn't drunk enough.
Q. You didn't take a man under the influence of liquor as you said he was, a man who had made a threat that he would perpetrate violence upon another person-you didn't take that manto the station house?
A. I did not, no.
Q. Then you don't know your duty as an officer.
MR. HOUSE: Then you don't know your duty as a public officer if you say that is the law. Q. How long had you known Madden?
A. I had known him for twelve years.
Q. You never had occasion to arrest him? A. No, sir.
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Q. You never saw him quarreling with any one?
A. I have never seen him quarreling. I might have seen him under the influence of liquor. Q. You never say him quarreling about the precinct to which you belong?
A. No, 8 sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. You were down here on a subpoena in this case for the first time yesterday? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You were in the court to on, were you not, when all the witnesses for the defense and the prosecution were directed to go on the outside?
A. Yes, sir.
THE COURT: We have got all of that. MR. HOUSE: I want to show-
THE COURT: You have shown. It is no use to show it over again. This officer says he was subpoenaed to appear before the grand Jury in a case of malicious mischief and that he tried to get into this court room but the
officer wouldn't permit him to do so and he went in and sat down in the Grand Jury room and read a newspaper when those two men were sitting in the room. That is the testimony.
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MR. HOUSE: Very well.
THOMAS DOWNEY, a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. What precinct are you attached to Mr. Downey? A. The 20th precinct.
Q. How long have you been a police officer in that precinct? A. Since 1884.
Q. How long have you been a police officer in the City of New York? A. Since 1884.
Q. Do you know a colored man named Johnson? A. Yes, sir.
Q. In May in the year 1893 before the shooting of Madden by Donnelly did you see Johnson at the station house?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What was the condition of his face at the time you saw him? THE COURT: No, that wont do.
MR. HOUSE: The witness Kiernan says that he went with the colored man Johnson to the station house and
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291
that his face was bleeding and that he left him in the custody of some officer. THE COURT: Refer me to the page of the stenographer's notes.
MR. HOUSE: I refer your Honor to page 132.
HTE COURT: (After examining the minutes.) I will allow you to put the question. Q. (Repeated.)
A. I was in the station house at the time. BY THE COURT:
Q. We have got that. What was the condition of his face at the time you saw him? A. His face was all cut here. There were four or five scars on his chee***k.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Was his face bleeding? A. Yes, sir..
Q. Where did you take him from the station house? A. Roosevelt ***Hospital.
Q. What was ***dond with him at Roosevelt ***Hospital, if you know? A. The Doctor stitched the wound?
Q. Sewed it up? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then where did he go, if you know?
291
that his face was bleeding and that he left him in the custody of some officer. THE COURT: Refer me to the page of the stenographer's notes.
MR. HOUSE: I refer your Honor to page 132.
HTE COURT: (After examining the minutes.) I will allow you to put the question. Q. (Repeated.)
A. I was in the station house at the time. BY THE COURT:
Q. We have got that. What was the condition of his face at the time you saw him? A. His face was all cut here. There were four or five scars on his chee***k.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Was his face bleeding? A. Yes, sir..
Q. Where did you take him from the station house? A. Roosevelt ***Hospital.
Q. What was ***dond with him at Roosevelt ***Hospital, if you know? A. The Doctor stitched the wound?
Q. Sewed it up? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And then where did he go, if you know?
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A. I don't know where he went after that, I cams back to the station house and he went away. CROSS examination by MR. McINTYRE:
Q. Now, you have been down here several days, haven't you? A. No, sir; this is the second time.
Q. You have been with the witnesses for the defense in this case? A. I have seen them.
Q. You have been talking with them? A. I spoke to Johnson?
Q. You spoke to Johnson and you talked to Butler?
A. I know Butler. I spoke to them but not about the case. Q. Were you subpoenaed to come down here?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you tell Donnelly that you had seen Johnson when he was cut? Not as I remember.
Q. Can you tell me how it was that they knew what you could testify about in this case? A. I don't know.
Q. You don't know how that fact was communicated to the defendant, his ***counsel and his friends? A. No.
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Q. Now, Officer Downey, you stated that you saw Johnson with his face cut and bleeding? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And stitches placed in it?
a Yes, sir.
Q. You have been an officer since 1884? A. I said 1884 but it was 1886.
Q. The Civil Service rules respecting the police were in vogue when you were appointed? A. Yes, sir.
Q. do you know who assaulted Johnson? A. I don't know only what he told me.
BY THE COURT: Q. He did tell you? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q. You knew that you had the evidence of the commission of a felony before you, the cutting of his face, you knew that was an assault in the second degree, and as a police officer you didn't do anything or attempt to arrest the man who committed that crime?
A. I was held by the Sergeant at the desk. I was probably ten blocks away from where the assault was committed.
Q. You knew as a policeman that you had a perfect right
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to apprehend the perpetrator of that felony? A. I done what the Sergeant told me.
Q. Did the Sergeant tell you not to? BY THE COURT:
Q. Did Johnson make any complaint when he was brought into the station house? A. He said he was assaulted.
Q. Did he say who the man was? A. He didn't state that, your Honor.
Q. Did the Sergeant order you not to arrest him? A. No, sir.
Q. Here was a man brought into the station house with his face cut and bleeding aid he made a complaint to the
Sergeant at the desk and you were told to go and take the man up to Roosevelt Hospital? Q. You were also told to arrest the man who cut this man's face?
A. No, sir.
Q. Who was that Sergeant? A. I could not tell you?
Q. When was it?
A. It was this month a year ago. I don't know the date.
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Q. Now, just fix this date as near as you can.
MR. HOUSE: I am going to prove all that, your Honor, and I will show -
MR. McINTYRE: And I will show there was no warrant issued on the complaint made. MR. HOUSE: I do not think a statement like that in the presence of the jury is fair.
Q. According to the testimony of this officer a man was brought in cut and bleeding to such an extent that he required surgical attendance. He was brought before the Sergeant at the desk and this officer was sent all the way from 20th Street to the Roosevelt Hospital with this man to have surgical attendance. Is that so?
A. That is right.
Q. Now, wont you fix the date of that occurence as near as you can? A. I can not give you the date. I think it was this month a year ago.
Q. This is the month of February just yet. Do you know who the Sergeant was? A. No, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Do you know whether or not the Ser-
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geant that night directed or instructed Johnson to go to the Police Court the next morning for a warrant? A. No, sir.
Q. You say you don't know whether or not the next morning Johnson did go to the Police Court and get a warrant?
A. No, sir.
Q. And that he was up there several times in that neighborhood with an officer from the Police Court looking for Madden and could not find him?
No answer.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Do you know anything about that? A. No, sir.
THE COURT: Gentlemen, you will observe the statutor admonition and be here to-morrow morning at 11 o'clock. Adjourned to 11 A. M. THURSDAY, MARCH 1, 1894.
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TRIAL RESUMED. March 1st, 1894.
HENRY JOHNSON; a witness called on behalf of the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION by Mr. House:
Q. Your name is Henry Johnson? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Whereabouts do you live, Mr. Johnson? A. 210 West 29th Street.
Q. And how long have you lived there? A.I live there a month, in 29th Street.
Q. And, before you resided in 210 West 29th Street, where did you reside, Mr. Johnson? A. In 28th Street; 253.
Q. What is your business at present, Johnson?
A. Well, I am attending to a sick man now, up in 55th Street; a Colored man. Q. As his private body servant?
A. No, sir; a colored friend of mine. Q.
A colored friend of yours?
A. Yes; sir.
Q. Well, where did you work in the year 1893? A. 1893?
By the Court:
Q. Yes; that is a year ago; last year?
A. Well, a year ago, I worked in a boarding house. By Mr. House:
Q.
A year 'go you worked in a boarding house? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. Now you know the saloon at the corner of 28th Street and 8th Avenue, do you not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. That is the saloon kept by Felix Donnelly? A. I do.
Q. Do you know a colored man by the name of Butler? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you ever work at Butler's boot blacking establishment, at that saloon? A. Yes, sir, I have.
Q. And was that during the year 1893? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you know a man by the name of Charles Madden in his lifetime? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where did you first meet Madden, if you know, Johnson? A. In 28th Street.
Q. On the corner or in the saloon?
A. On the corner, part of the time; and in the saloon, was most of the acquaintance I had.
Q. Well, how often would you meet Madden in that saloon, during the year 1893, if you can now recall?
A. Well I would meet him in there four or five times in the week, and most especially at night, when he would get off from his work.
Q. Now, do you recollect being in that saloon in the month of February last? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And was that the time that a young man ---- By the Court:
Q. February a year ago? A. Yes, sir.
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By Mr. House:
Q. Yes, sir. February a year ago, Mr. Johnson? A. Yes, sir, I do.
Q. And do you recollect whether Madden was in the saloon on that night or not? A. Yes, sir, he was.
Q. And was there anyone in there, with an umbrella, at the time?. A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now who was that young man that had the umbrella, if you can tell, Mr. Johnson?
A. I don't know his name, but he has been quite ---- he has been a visitor in there for some time. Q. Yes. Now did any discussion, during the evening, arise regarding that umbrella?
A. Yes, sir.
Mr. McIntyre: Objected to as immaterial. The Court: The 8th of February last?
Mr. House: Yes, sir.
The Court: What is the object of this testimony - to prove a threat?
Mr. House: No; to prove the assault upon this man, and to show that, as Mr. Kiernan said, that he did not attempt to assault Madden; and then to follow it up by showing that Madden not only threatened him, but threatened the defendant, Donnelly.
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Mr. McIntyre: An assault upon this man, may it please the Court, is entirely irrelevant. That does not justify the killing of another man.
The Court: If any threat was made by the deceased against the defendant, I will let you prove it.
Mr. House: Well, then, sir, there was some question yesterday regarding whether this man, after this assault, went for a warrant. I thought we could show that to the jury, and the District Attorney went into it on the
cross examination.
The Court: That was the trouble about it, that is the reason I let in so much, because the District Attorney
went into it, on cross examination, and brought out what I would have otherwise excluded. That was exactly the trouble about it. I think I will let it in. Go on.
By Mr. House:
Q. Mow just, in your own way, Mr. Johnson ---- By the Court:
Q. Now just tell us - was the defendant there and was Madden there? A. Mr. James Donnelly was there; he was behind the bar.
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Q. And was Madden there? A. Yes, sir. go on and tell what happened there?
A. Well Madden came in, and I was standing in there, and Madden called for a glass of mixed ale, and Mr. Donnelly gave him a goblet with a stem to it. He was standing at the upper end of the bar, and he didn't drink his drink, and he stood there for about five minutes, as near as I can remember. So this, young man came in.
Q. The young man with the umbrella?
A. Yes, sir; and I have met him in there lots of times, and he asked me up to have a drink with him. Him and
Patsy Kiernan were shaking poker ***dise for a drink; and, in the meantime, he lost his umbrella, and he
turned around to me and he said, "Johnson, have you seen my umbrella?" and I said, "No, sir, I didn't"; and he looked around for it and he said, "You must have known something about it. You were standing between me and Patsy Kiernan," and I said, "I don't know anything about it", and he said, "You ought to have known something about it, because you were right here", and I said "I don't, and I wouldn't take anything from you or anybody
else," and Madden said, "I don't want you, Johnson, to give any of my white friends a calling down in this place," and I said, "Madden, I would give you, or anybody else, a calling down
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if they accused me of stealing anything in this place"; and he said, "Neither you nor any other black son of a bitch has a right to call any white friend of mine - to give any white friend of mine a calling down, and,
more-over, no black Bon of a bitch has any right to give any back talk to a white man," and I walked away from him, and he whirled with the glass, and struck me on the side of the head, right here (indicating).
Q. Did he throw the glass at you? A. No, sir; he held it in his hand. By Mr. House:
Q. And those scars on your face are the result of the blow?
A. Yes, sir; and he knocked me about 15 feet down the room and ---- Q. Well, what happened then?
The Court: Well let him finish. What were you going to say?
A. And I landed up against the lunch bar and Mr. James Donnelly said, "Johnson, you are cut," and I didn't know I was cut; and so, with that, I pulled out my handkerchief out of my pocket, and wiped my face, and Madden run out of the front door, and I went out of the side door, and I didn't see him going uptown, and I come inside, and went
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out the front door, and I looked up 8th Avenue, and he was just turning 29th Street, and Pat sy Kiernan carried me over----
The Court: Now, you have got the man outside of the saloon, Mr. House, and I will not allow anything that occurred outside the saloon. Now go back to the saloon. By the Court:
Q. Was there anything else that happened in the saloon that you have not stated? A. No, sir.
Q. Was anything said more than you have told us? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, now, did you go to the station house that night? A. I went to the druggist first.
Q. Where?
A. At 28th Street and 8th Avenue, and at 29th Street and 8th Avenue, and neither one of them would do anything for me, and I went to the station house.
Q. And from there where did you go? A. Mr. Downing carried me to the Roosevelt Hospital. Q. And was anything done to you there?
A. Yes, sir, I was treated; the doctor attended to me there.
Q. Now, did you go to the police court, after that, and make a complaint, Mr. Johnson? A. Yes, sir; about three days after that, as near as I can remember.
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Q. What police court did you go to? A. Jefferson Market.
Q. Do you know whether or not a warrant was issued?
The Court: Well, if the warrant was issued, I suppose you can produce it. By the Court:
Q. Did you see the warrant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. First, do you know what a warrant is? A. Oh, no, sir, I don't know.
The Court: He would not get the warrant, undoubtedly; a police officer would.
Mr. House: Well, I think I can show that a paper was issued to a police officer and this witness ----
The Court: Well, you can get the police officer and the warrant. This man does not know a warrant from anything else.
Mr. House: Very well, sir. By Mr. House:
Q. Now, Johnson, you were not present in the saloon, on the 28th day of May, 1893, when the shooting occurred;
were you? A. No, sir.
Q. Do you recollect that, two or three weeks before the shooting, on a Sunday afternoon, that you saw Madden and a fel-
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low by the name of Morris? A. Charles Morris? Q. Yes.
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And, after you saw them, did you see Police Officer Cole-man? A. Yes, sir, I did.
Q. And now, just before you saw Police Officer Coleman, what took place between you and Madden? A. I came around the corner, and Madden said, "Hello, Johnson."
Mr. McIntyre: Objected to, as not being in the saloon. By the Court:
Q. It was outside, on the street? A. Yes, sir, on the corner.
The Court: Well, finish then. If he made a threat, outside, in the street, although it was not communicated to the defendant, it is admissible.
Q. Now, what did he say in reference to Donnelly, if anything?
A. Well, I came around the corner, and Madden said, "Hello, Johnson." I thought it was the young man that I
was working with and ---- By Mr. House:
Q. Never mind what you thought. A. And I turned around and I seen who it was, and I said, "Madden, don't you never
speak to me any more, unless I speak to you first, and I
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went into the saloon, and him and Charles Morris followed me in there, and Madden caught me by the collar, with his right hand, and drew back with his left hand, as if he was going to hit me, and I said,, "Madden, I don't want no trouble with you or Charlie Morris neither, and the best thing you can do is to let me alone,"
and I went out, and they followed me out, and I met Mr. Coleman at the corner, and I explained the matter to him.
By the Court:
Q. That will do about that. What did Coleman do? A. He told him, Madden, if he didn't get off the corner, he would lock him up, and two young men carried him off; and, as they were carrying him off he said, "Never mind. I will fix Johnson, and also that Jimmy Donnelly that had me put off the corner. I'll get square on both of
them."
Q. And hat was said in the presence of the police officer? A. Yes, sir; Mr. Coleman.
Mr. House: Mr. Coleman testified to it, yesterday, your Honor-; Officer Coleman, rather. By Mr. House:
Q. Now how long had you seen Madden about that corner and in that saloon, Johnson? A. About a year and a half, as near. as I can remember.
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Q. Did you over see him drink? A. Yes, sir, lots of times.
Q. Lots of times? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you ever see him under the influence of liquor? A. Yes, sir.
The court: well, what do you mean by the influence of liquor? I suppose every man that drinks liquor, if it is only a spoonful, must be under the influence of it. By the Court:
Q. Did you see him drink? A. Yes, sir.
By Mr. House:
Q. Did you see him intoxicated? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, what was his character, as a peaceable and quiet man, when you saw him around there; was it good or bad?
A. No, sir. When Madden was drinking, he was very mussy. Q. When Madden was drinking, he was very mussy?
A. Yes, sir; and that was very often. CROSS EXAMINATION by Mr. McIntyre:
Q. How many times have you been convicted? A. Convicted?
Q. Yes, arrested and convicted? A. Three times.
Q. What were you convicted for the first time? A. The first time for fighting.
Q. For stabbing a man, was it not? A. No, sir.

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Q. Well, how did you assault him then, how did you strike him

A. The young man struck me, and I struck him. Q. And you were sent away for it; weren't you? A. I was arrested.

Q. And the next time?

A. For gambling in the street. Q. Where?

A. In Washington, D. C. Q. And the next time?

A. It was for gambling. Q. Where?

A. In Washington.

Q. Well, when next? A. Only three times. Q. Only three times? A. Yes, sir.

Q. Now you have been working in gambling houses for a number of years; have you not? A. No, sir; I never worked in any gambling house.

Q. Didn't you work in a gambling house in Washington? A. No, sir.

Q. What did you do there? A. I was a waiter man.

Q. Where?

A. In Washington.

Q. Where in Washington?

A. On Rhode Island Avenue and on Connecticut Avenue. Q. How long have you been North?

A. Six years.

Q. Where were you born? A. In Memphis, Tennessee.

Q. What did you work at there?

A. I was a lad there, and I was brought to Virginia quite young.

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Q. Where did you go from Tennessee? A. To the state of Virginia.

Q. And what did you do there? A. I worked on a farm.

Q. how long did you stay there? A. Well I stayed there until I left. Q. What?

A. Well I stayed there quite a number of years. Q. How many years?

A. I guess about six or seven years.

Q. When did you leave Memphis, Tennessee? A. When did I leave there?

Q. Yes.

A. I left there quite young. My mother brought me away from there. Q. When, what year?

A. I don't know what year it was.

Q. Where did you go to from Virginia?

A. I came to Virginia from Memphis, Tennessee. Q. And how long did you stay in Virginia?

A. All my life up.

Q. Well, how many years ago did you leave there? A. I left there in 1883.

Q. And where did you go to? A. I came to Washington City. Q. And what did you do there? A. I waited.

Q. For whom?

A. For private families, different parties. Q. And how long did you stay there?

A. About nine years, as near as I can***remember. Q. And you were a waiter all the time?

A. As a waiter, part

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of the time.

Q. And where did you go then?

A. I came to New York, I told you. Q. When did you reach New York?

A. I came here the year of the Centennial. Q. 1876?

A. No, sir; this last Centennial. Q. 1888?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Where did you go to work in New York first?

A. I went to work for a colored man at South Beach. Q. What kind of a place did he keep?

A. Fruit stand.

Q. How long did you work for him? A. About three or four months.

Q. And where did you go to then?

A. Well I came to New York, and went into a boarding house. Q. Where?

A. Uptown.

Q. Well where? A. In 31st Street.

Q. What kind of a house was it? A.
A boarding house.

Q. Between what avenues? A. No. 17 East 31st Street. Q. No. 17 East 31st?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Who kept the house? A. Mrs. Kent.

Q. And what did you do there? A.
A waiter man.

Q. And how long did you work for her? A. About three months.

Q. What did you leave her for? A. She discharged me.

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311

Q. What for?

A. Because she didn't pay me, and I wouldn't work.

Q. Yes. She discharged you because she didn't pay you? A. Well, I asked for my money, and she discharged me. Q. Where did you go then?

A. To 23rd Street.

Q. What did you do there? A. I was a waiter man.

Q. For whom?

A. I forget the lady's name.

Q. How long did you stay there? A. About three or four months.

Q. What did you leave there for?

A. I didn't leave there; she broke up housekeeping. Q. And where did you go then?

A. Up to 52nd Street, and worked 111 a barber shop. Q. Did you black boots there?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. How long did you stay there? A.
A couple of months.

Q. And then where did you go to? A. I went away to the country then. Q. Where?

A. To New burgh, New York.

Q. Well, what did you go there for? A. To work.

Q. For whom?

A. To the hotel, to the Merchant's Hotel. Q. For whom?

A. I forgot his name; as a waiter. Q. How long aid you stay there? A. All the season.

Q. And where did you go to then? A. I came back to Mew York.

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512
Q. And where did you go then? A. I worked in a boarding house. Q. How long did you stay there? A. About four months.
Q. What boarding house was it? A. Up in 52nd Street.
Q. What was the woman's name, up in 52nd Street, that you worked for? A. I don't know her name; I forget it. Q. Weren't you discharged from that house?
A. No, sir
Q. For stealing?
A. No, sir; I never stole anything in my lfe.
Q. I ask you, weren't you discharged from that house for stealing? A. No, sir.
Q. How long did you stay there?
A. I stayed there about four months.
Q. Where did you go to after you left that place?
A. After I left there, I was out of work quite a while. Q. Where did you live during that time?
A. In 28th Street. Q. With whom?
A. By myself; I housekeeper*** there.
Q. You lived with a housekeeper there? A. No, sir, by myself.
Q. Did you keep house there? A. Not now, I don't ***.k
Q. Well, did you keep house there? A. I did, at that time.
Q. You had a housekeeper there? A. No, sir.
Q. Are you married? A. Yes, sir, I am.
512
Q. And where did you go then? A. I worked in a boarding house. Q. How long did you stay there? A. About four months.
Q. What boarding house was it? A. Up in 52nd Street.
Q. What was the woman's name, up in 52nd Street, that you worked for? A. I don't know her name; I forget it. Q. Weren't you discharged from that house?
A. No, sir
Q. For stealing?
A. No, sir; I never stole anything in my lfe.
Q. I ask you, weren't you discharged from that house for stealing? A. No, sir.
Q. How long did you stay there?
A. I stayed there about four months.
Q. Where did you go to after you left that place?
A. After I left there, I was out of work quite a while. Q. Where did you live during that time?
A. In 28th Street. Q. With whom?
A. By myself; I housekeeper*** there.
Q. You lived with a housekeeper there? A. No, sir, by myself.
Q. Did you keep house there? A. Not now, I don't ***.k
Q. Well, did you keep house there? A. I did, at that time.
Q. You had a housekeeper there? A. No, sir.
Q. Are you married? A. Yes, sir, I am.
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313
Q. Where is your wife?
A. She deserted me, about three years ago. Q. Yes?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And what did you do, after you left that place in 28th Street? A. What place? The house?
Q. Yes?
A. Well, I went away to the country.
Q. Did you live in a place called "The Black Chapel", in 28th Street? A. No, sir.
Q. You didn't live there? A. No, sir.
Q. Never?
A. I don't know any such a place there. Q. You don't know of any such place? A. No, sir.
Q. How? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, where did you go to work next; after that last employment that you have just mentioned? A. I told you I went away to the country.
Q. Well I know you told me that. I want to know where you went to work? A. Up to New burgh.
Q. Well, I am not speaking of that place. You say you came back and lived in 28th Street? A. Well, I was in New burgh more than once. I went to Johnson's.
Q.
A different place?
A. Yes, sir; the United States Hotel. Q. How long did you stay there?
A. About four months.
Q. What did you leave there for? A. The wages was too small.

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Q. What were you getting there? A. $18. a month.

Q. Where did you go then? A. I came back to New York.

Q. And who did you work for? Give me the name? A. In New-burgh?

Q. No, sir.

A. In New York? Q. Yes.

A. Well, I went to work for Mr. Johnson, the proprietor of the hotel. Q. Well, what did he pay you?

A. Well that's the same man; $18. a month; and I came back to New York, and went to work for a colored man, named Smith.

Q. At what?

A. At whitewashing; for $2.00 a day. Q. How much did you get a day?

A. $2.00.

Q. What did you do for him?

A. Whitewashing and kalsomining. Q. How long did you work for him? A. About two months.

Q. And why did you leave him?

A. Because there was no more work.

Q. And where did you go to work then? A. Well, I didn't go to work nowhere.

Q. Then what did you do?

A. I used to help my friend, on the corner. Q. Doing what?

A. Shining shoes.

Q. Well, who was your friend? A. John Butler.

Q. And he had a bootblack stand? A. Yes, sir.

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Q. And have you worked anywheres Since then? A. Yes, sir.
Q. For whom?
A. Well I did jobbing around, for different persons. Q. Well, did Butler pay you for shining shoes?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. How much did he pay you?
A. Half that I made on the stand, half that he made.
Q. Well, have you done anything else bu*** boot blacking there, since that time? A. For Butler?
Q. Yes.
A. I used to help him clean up the store.
a friend of the defendant at the bar, Donnelly; aren't you? A. No, sir.
Q. You are no friend of his?
A. I ain't no friend of him; I know him.
Q. You have known him for quite a long time, haven't you? A. About a year.
Q. Now where did you get the clothes that you have on? A. Where did I get them?
Q. Yes?
A. I bought them. Q. When?
A. About a year ago; some of them.
Q. Let me see the coat that you have on? A. There it is.
Q. You say you bought that coat a year ago? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now let me see your underclothes. No, I don't mean those. I mean the suit under the overcoat? A. There it is.
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Q. Didn't Donnelly give you that coat? A. No, sir.
Q. Or his brother?
A. No, sir; they never gave me a piece of clothes in my life. Q. Did you have that coat on day, before yesterday?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. The first day you came down to court here, did you have that overcoat on? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What are those - gloves - that you have in your pocket?
A. Yes, sir. The first day I came to this court I had the coat on, and those are gloves. Q. Now how much money have you got to come down here to testify?
A. How much money have I got?
Q. Yes; how much money have you got?
A. I didn't get any money to come down here and testify. Q. No money given you at all?
A. No, sir.
Q. No money promised to you by the Donnellys? A. No, sir, none of them.
Q. No money been promised you? A. No, sir.
Q. Don't you expect to get paid for coming down here? A. No, sir.
Q. You don't expect to get paid? A. No, sir.
Q. What were you working at, yesterday, and the day before that? A. I was down here yesterday.
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Q. Well, did you have any visible means of support, yesterday***. A. No, sir*
Q. Were you working at anything? A. No, sir; I went down here.
Q. Well, what were you doing the day before that? A. I was here.
Q. Where were you the day before that? A. Uptown, attending to the sick man.
Q. Who is he?
A. Henry Jones.
Q. Where does he live? A. 532 West 55th Street. Q. What does he do?
A. He don't do nothing; he is laying in bed, sick. Q. Does he pay you anything?
A. Yes, sir, $3.00.
Q. What is his business? A. Janitor.
Q. For whom?
A. I don't know, sir.
Q. Now, Johnson, you have had a number of fights in Donnelly's place, on the corner of 28th Street and 8th
Avenue; haven't you? A. No, sir.
Q. Do you mean to say that you have not had various difficulties in that place? A. No, sir.
Q. Various troubles?
A. The only trouble I ever had was from that mark there (indicating his head). Q. Haven't you assaulted people in that place?
A. I never assaulted a man in my life, sir.
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Q. How long did you know Madden?
A. I knew Madden about a year and a half, as near as I can remember.
Q. Before the difficulty between you and Madden there was no other trouble between you; was there? A. I never had no trouble with Madden before.
Q. And as far as you know, he was quiet and peaceable before that? A. Oh, no sir; when he were drinking he weren't.
Q. Well, have you seen him frequently drunk? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How many times?
A. Ten or twelve times.
Q. And did he have a difficulty with you every time he was under the influence of liquor? A. Once or twice he walked towards me, but I would always get out of his way.
Q. Now, who was the young man who was in the store the night you were assaulted? THE COURT: The young man with the Umbrella.
BY MR. MCINTYRE: Q. With the umbrella? A. I don't know, sir.
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Q. Did you ever see him before?
A. Yes, sir; lots of times, in the store.
Q. Now, didn't you, lots of times before the alleged assault, steal handkerchiefs out of his, pocket? A. No, sir.
Q. Weren't you accused of it?.
A. One night I were, but he found it afterwards. Q. But weren't you on other nights?
A. No, sir.
Q. Wouldn't you stand on his right side, at the upper end of the bar, and take handkerchiefs out of his coat pocket?
A. No, sir; I didn't.
Q. And he accused you, on more than one occasion, of doing it; didn't he? A. Not as I knows of.
Q. Well, you said that he did accuse you, one night?
A. He accuse me one night, but he received the hand@@ kerchief back. Some of his wife's friends had it. Q. You were drinking with him; were you?
A. Yes, sir; I had one drink with him.
Q. Now, the night in question, this young man, whose name you don't know, had an umbrella with him; didn't he?
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A. Yes, sir; he had an umbrella with him when he came in.
Q. And he put the umbrella down outside of the bar, leaned up against the Bar? A. Yes sir.
Q. And you were standing right up by him, when he did that? A. I were.
Q. And shortly afterwards the young man missed his umbrella; is not that so? A. Three of us were standing there.
Q. Well, now, don't bring anybody else into it. I am talking of you. A. Yes, sir.
Q. And he told you that he stole his umbrella? A. He asked me did I see anything of it.
Q. (Question repeated)? A. No, sir; he didn't.
Q. Well, he charged you with taking it? A. No, sir; he asked me had I seen it.
Q. Yes. And you told him that he was a dammed liar, and that you did not take it; didn't you? A. No, sir.
Q. HOW? A. No, sir. A. No, sir.
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Q. Well, what did you say to him?
A. I told him---- I says, "I wouldn't take your umbrella, and I wouldn't steal nothing from you or no one else."
Q. Well, who was tending bar that night? A. James Donnell***y.
Q. Now, do you remember taking that umbrella from the place where the young man put it, and passing it over the bar and giving it to the defendant?
A. No, sir.
Q. Didn't you see the umbrella afterwards, behind the bar? A. No, sir.
Q. Do you know who took it and put it behind the bar? A. No, sir.
Q. Who else was there?
A. Well, there were lots of others. Q. Who else was there?
A. Patsy Kiernan and the young man that lost the umbrella and James Donnelly was behind the bar and several others were standing around.
Q. But they were not standing near you; were they? A. Yes, sir; standing all, around the floor.
Q. Drinking with you? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, the party that I am speaking of was composed of you
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and Kiernan and the man that lost the umbrella and Madden, and you were standing together; weren't you? A. Maiden was standing up, above all of us. I wasnt standing there.
Q. Who were you drinking with?
A. The man that had the umbrella, individually. Q. You were drinking with him?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, didn't you pick up that umbrella and pass it over the bar and hand it to Donnelly? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, don't you know, as matter of fact, that, after that man went out of the place, the umbrella was found behind the bar?
A. No, sir.
Q. Did you ever see that it was? A. No, sir.
Q. You never heard what became of the umbrella? A. No, sir.
Q. You stood right there, and didn't see anybody take it? A. No, sir.
Q. Now, the dead man, Maiden, came to you and he said, "Now, you have been in the habit of stealing this man's handkerchief, and I think you have stolen the umbrella from him;" didn't he?
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A. No, sir; he didn't.
Q. "You were nearest to him, and no one else could have done it;" did he say that to you? A. No, sir.
Q. What did he say to you?
A. All that he said was, "Johnson, I don't want you to give any of my white friends a calling down in here," and I said, "I would give you or any one else a calling down that accused me of a crime that I am not guilty of."
Q. Now, I want to know if Ms Madden charged you with stealing the umbrella. A. No, sir; he didn't charge me with the stealing of it.
Q. But the young man that you were drinking with charged you, you say? MR. HOUSE: No, sir; he said that he asked ***him where it was.
THE WITNESS: No, sir; he didn't. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
(objected to, on the ground that the District Attorney has three
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times asked the question, and the witness has said that he didn't accuse him of stealing it.) THE COURT: That is a slightly different question. I will allow it.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, did Madden say that you stole the umbrella? A. No, sir.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Well, what did Madden say to you? A. I told you what he said, Your Honor. Q. Well, what did he say?
A. He said, "Johnson, I don't want you to give any of my white friends a calling down in this place." Q. Well, had you called any of his white friends down?
A. Well, after this young man insisted that I knew something about it, I told him that I wouldnt steal any@@
thing from him or any one else.
Q. "Well, now, you say that he did insist upon stating that you knew something about? A. He asked me--he said, "You must know something of
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of it, because you were standing here.
Q. And then you called him down, as you put it? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, what did you say to the young man?
A. I told him I knew nothing of it, and that I wouldnt steal anything from him or anyone else. That was all that was said.
Q. Now, Mr. Kiernan was there that night; wasn't he? A. Yes, sir; Patsy Kiernan.
Q. And Paddy Kiernan?
A. Yes, sir; Paddy Kiernan.
Q. Now, I want to ask you whether you remember anything like this having occurred. I will read you Kiernan's testimony. He said, "This fellow came into, the saloon. He is a pretty rood spender, and he came in to throw dice. He had a silk umbrella in his hand, and he put it against the bar, and it was missed in a little while,
and Madden was standing there, with the glass of beer in his hand, and Johnson said he didn't take the
umbrella, as somebody had accused him of it; he said he didn't take the umbrella. Madden turned and said, "One of you fellows
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took it.' pointing around the bar to Johnson. Johnson said, 'You are a white son-of-a-bitch," Did you say that?
A. No, sir; I didn't.
Q. "Madden said, 'Don't call me a son-of-a-bitch," and, with that, Madden threw the glass and hit him." A. He didn't throw it, sir.
Q. How?
A. He didn't throw the glass. Q. He didn't throw the glass?
A. No, sir; he held it in his hand.
Q. Now, when Madden accused you of taking that umbrella, if he did accuse you, did you go down in your pocket and take out a knife?
A. Madden didn't accuse me, and I didn't go down in my pocket and take out a knife. I had no occasion to do it.
Q. Well, if anybody said that you took the umbrella, did you take out the knife? A. No, sir.
Q. Now didn't you assault Madden first? A. No, sir.
Q. Didn't you rush at him with a knife? A. No, sir.
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Q. Didn't you threaten to use the knife upon him? A. No, sir.
Q. Didn't you put your hand in your pocket and take out a knife? A. No, sir; I didn't.
Q. How many people were in th store? A. I don't, know, sir.
Q. You can't tell? A. No, sir.
Q. How many friends of yours were there? A. I have no friends there.
Q. Well, lid you see anybody there that you knew, that you were friendly with? A. Well, I knew James Donnelly.
Q. Yes.
A. And Madden.
Q. Well, where was Butler? A. He was home, I suppose. Q. He was home; was he?
A. I suppose he were.
Q. You didn't see Butler there that night? A. He was there the early part of the night.
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BY THE COURT:
Q. At what time of the night?
A. He was there about half-past 8, and I walked to the car corner of 29th Street with him, and then I came back.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Now, did you see Tucker there? A. No, sir; Tucker was not there.
Q. And you are sure that Butler was not inside there that night? A. Butler was there the early part of the night.
Q. Well, when you were hit? A. No, sir; he was not.
Q. Well, when you were a truck with the glass, what, did you do? Did you strike back? A. I had no chance.
Q. No. Did you? A. No, sir; I didn't.
THE COURT: Answer the question. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Did you strike back? A. No, sir.
.Q Did you attempt to defend yourself? A. No, sir; not in the least.
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Q. Well, what did you do?
A. Well, he knocked me about 15 feet down the room. Q. He knocked you about 15 feet down the room?
A. Yes, sir; as near as I could judge; up against the lunch counter. Q. Well, you say that he held the glass in his hand?
A. Yes, sir; and he pounded me like that(illustrating). Q. And it knocked you down the room 15 feet?
A. Yes, sir; as near as I can judge. Q. And what did you do then?
A. I whipped off my vest and went out the side door, and I don't see Madden, and then I came in again and went out again, out of the front door and I saw him turning the 29th Street corner.
Q. And then you went to the drug store? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And the hospital? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, why didn't you go to a police officer and complain that you had been assaulted without any cause? A. I didn't see any police officer on my way up there,
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and I was bleeding so that I went on.
Q. Well, you saw police officers after you went to the hospital; didn't you? A. Yes, sir; I saw more than one.
Q. Did you go to the station-house at all? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, you saw plenty of police officers there; didn't you?
A. Yes, sir; but the sergeant sent me in the back room, and the doctor was sent for, and the doctor said that he couldn't do anything for me, and I must go to the hospital, and I was taken to the hospital by Mr. D***Owning.
Q. Did you walk or ride?
A. I rode on the car. Mr. Downing paid the fare. A. Officer Downing.
Q. Well, did you tell him what Madden had done to you? A.
Yes, sir.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Well, do you remember the day of the week that this assault occured? Was it Monday, Tuesday or Wednesday? BY THE COURT:
330
and I was bleeding so that I went on.
Q. Well, you saw police officers after you went to the hospital; didn't you? A. Yes, sir; I saw more than one.
Q. Did you go to the station-house at all? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, you saw plenty of police officers there; didn't you?
A. Yes, sir; but the sergeant sent me in the back room, and the doctor was sent for, and the doctor said that he couldn't do anything for me, and I must go to the hospital, and I was taken to the hospital by Mr. D***Owning.
Q. Did you walk or ride?
A. I rode on the car. Mr. Downing paid the fare. A. Officer Downing.
Q. Well, did you tell him what Madden had done to you? A.
Yes, sir.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Well, do you remember the day of the week that this assault occured? Was it Monday, Tuesday or Wednesday? BY THE COURT:
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Q. What day or the week was it that you were hit with the glass?
A. It was the 6th, I know; I am not sure, but I think it was on a Monday. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. It was on a Monday? A. If I am not mistaken.
Q. And after you had your wounds dressed, you came back to Donnelly's saloon; didn't you? BY THE COURT:
Q. You said that you found out in the station-house that it was Monday; did you? A. No, sir; I said as far as I could remember it was Monday.
Q. Did you find out in the station-house what day it was? A. No, sir; I didn't try to find out the day.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Well, did you go back to Donnelly's saloon that night after your wounds were dressed? A. Yes, sir; I stopped in on my way home.
Q. And how long did you stay there that night?
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A. In Donnelly's place? Q. Yes?
A. I stayed in about three minutes, because a couple of the stitches were broke, and I had to go back to the hospital.
Q. And the next day did you go back to Dennelly's place? A. No, sir I was unable to go.
Q. Did you go out at all? A. No, sir.
Q. The next day after that did you go to Donnelly's place? A. No, sir.
Q. When did you g***o to Donnelly's place for the first time, after that?
A. I went there about the 4th day afterwards. I stopped up there on my way to the hospital, and borrowed ten cents from my colored friend there, to pay my way up and back.
Q. Now, you say that those scars on your face were made by the glass? A. Yes, sir.
Q. That was thrown at you or pitched at you at the time?
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A. He held it in his hand, at the time. Q. Did the glass break?
A. Surely it did. It broke up in little pieces.
Q. Yes. And the push that he gave you with the glass in his hand shoved you 15 feet? A. As near as I can judge.
Re-Direct-examination. BY MR HOUSE:
Q. How, Mr. Johnson. A. Sir?
Q. Did you hear the Recorder, yesterday, put this question, yesterday, to Butler:
***"Q Were you present at any dif@@ ficulty between Madden and Johnson?" And did you hear Butler swear, "I was not there"?
A. No, sir.
Q. You were outside? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And Butler was not there? A. No, sir.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Now, did you hear the Recorder say that to the witness yesterday? A. No, sir.
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Q. Well, where were you? A. I was outside.
BY MR HOUSE:
Q. Now, you have been asked about your criminal record. You say that you have been arrested three times? A. Yes, sir.
Q. The first time you were ever arrested was for fighting? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What disposition was made of that case, Mr. Johnson; what was done with it? A. I was fo***nnd $ 5.00.
Q. Did you pay it? A. Yes, sir; I did.
Q. Now, You were twice, after that, arrested for gambling? A. Yes, sir.'
Q. On the street? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was that the kind of gambling which you colored people sometimes indulge in, which is called "shooting craps"?
A. Yes, sir; shooting *** to a dice.
Q. And what was done with you on both of those occasions? A. Well, I paid my fine the first time, $5.00.
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Q. Well, where were you? A. I was outside.
BY MR HOUSE:
Q. Now, you have been asked about your criminal record. You say that you have been arrested three times? A. Yes, sir.
Q. The first time you were ever arrested was for fighting? A. Yes, sir.
Q. What disposition was made of that case, Mr. Johnson; what was done with it? A. I was fo***nnd $ 5.00.
Q. Did you pay it? A. Yes, sir; I did.
Q. Now, You were twice, after that, arrested for gambling? A. Yes, sir.'
Q. On the street? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was that the kind of gambling which you colored people sometimes indulge in, which is called "shooting craps"?
A. Yes, sir; shooting *** to a dice.
Q. And what was done with you on both of those occasions? A. Well, I paid my fine the first time, $5.00.
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Q. And the second time?
A. The second time, I got discharged. Q. You got discharged?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And with the exceptions of these three occasions, where you were fined $5.00 for fighting, and $5.00 once
for shooting craps, and once discharged, upon being arrested for shooting craps, you have never been charged with the commission of any crime?
A. No, sir; nowhere.
Q. And have you ever been convicted of stealing anything of any kind and sent to prison for it? A. No, sir; never in my life.
FRANK RAFFERTY, called by The Defense, being duly sworn, testified as follows: Direct-examination.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Mr. Rafferty, whereabouts do you live? A. 447 West 37th Street.
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BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Have you been outside of the court-room all the while? A. Yes, sir.
MR. HOUSE: Yes; he has just been brought in. BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. What is your business, Mr. Rafferty? A. Bartender.
Q. And by whom are you employed? A. By Felix Donnelly.
Q. The cousin of this defendant? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you been employed by Mr. Donnelly as a bartender? A. Something over three months.
Q. And whereabouts are you tending bar? A. 362 8th Avenue.
Q. Is that the saloon where the shooting occurred? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know a fellow by the name of Davis? A. Yes, sir.
Q. One of the witnesses for The People in this case? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you remember that, one day last month, that Davis was in the saloon? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. Who else was in the saloon at the time, if you recollect? A. Thomas Rawley and James O'K***eefe.
Q. Now, while they were in there, was any conversation started regarding the Donnelly case? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And what , if anything, did Davis say regarding it?
A. Davis said that he knew nothing at all concerning the affair, nothing whatsomever. Q. Yes.
A. And he said he wouldnt be implicated in it only for Patrick Kiernan. Cross-Examination.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. He said he wouldnt be implicated in it excepting for Patrick Kiernan? A. Yes, sir.
Q. That Patrick Kiernan had gone and told somebody what Davis knew about it.
A. What the words he said to me were, he wouldnt be implicated in it only for Patrick Kiernan
Q. Yes. That, if Patrick Kiernan hadn't told somebody
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what he knew about the case, he wouldnt be implicated in it? A. He didn't say any more than I said.
Q. Well, give us his conversation as fully as you can. A. That was the whole conversation.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, how is this conversation brought about? A. We were conversing about the Donnelly affair. Q. Who was?
A. Charles Davis, Thomas Rawley and James O'Keefe. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Look me in the face, and ***den't through your head down. A. Yes, sir.
Now, what were they saying about the Donnelly affair? A. Well, they were talking about how he would make it. Q. Now, look me in the eyes. What?
A. They were conversing how he would make out, and when his trial would come off. Q. Who was saying that?
A. Davis and Rawley.
Q. What did Davis say? Give me Davis's exact words.
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what he knew about the case, he wouldnt be implicated in it? A. He didn't say any more than I said.
Q. Well, give us his conversation as fully as you can. A. That was the whole conversation.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, how is this conversation brought about? A. We were conversing about the Donnelly affair. Q. Who was?
A. Charles Davis, Thomas Rawley and James O'Keefe. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Look me in the face, and ***den't through your head down. A. Yes, sir.
Now, what were they saying about the Donnelly affair? A. Well, they were talking about how he would make it. Q. Now, look me in the eyes. What?
A. They were conversing how he would make out, and when his trial would come off. Q. Who was saying that?
A. Davis and Rawley.
Q. What did Davis say? Give me Davis's exact words.
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A. Davis's exact words? That he didn't know anything at all concerning the affair, and that he wouldnt be implicated in it whatever, only for Patrick Kiernan.
Q. That he wouldnt be implicated in it? A. Yes, sir.
Now, didnt you hear him say that the prosecution would not have known anything of what he knew about the case?
A. No, sir.
Q. If it hadn't been for Kiernan telling it? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you hear all that said? A. No, sir; I didn't.
Q. It might have been said and you might not have heard it? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, then, you don't know whether that was said or not?
A. I don't know. He said that he didnt know anything whatsomever about the affair. BY THE COURT:
Q. What did Rawley say?
A. He didnt say anything at all, while I was there. Q. And what did James O'Keefe say?
A. I dont know anything at all what he said only
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what Davis said. I only come down to the end of the bar then.
Q. No. I asked you what James O'Keefe said. What did he say? A. I don't know.
Q. And you don't know what Rawley said? A. No, sir.
Q. Now, what did you say?
A. I asked him if he knew anything about it, and that is what he said. Q. If he knew anything about what?
A. About the shooting affair. Q. The shooting of whom? A.Charles Madden.
Q. Well, what did you say to him?
A. I asked him did he know anything at all about it, and he said he didnt. Q. And is that all you said?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And that is all he said to you?
A. Yes, sir; that is all. I went on, then, and attended to my business. Q. Well, didn't you say something to the other man that was
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with him? A. No, sir.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. You can't remember what the other men said?
A. I didnt wait to listen to that. I was attending to my business. Q. But you can remember what Davis said?
A. Yes, sir; because he was conversing with me at the time.
Q. Now, why did you ask him what he knew about the Donnelly affair? A. For information.
Q. Well, what information were you seeking? A. Well, I only wanted to know about it.
Q. You did? For what purpose?
A. I hadn't any purpose in view atball.
Q. Well, you stated, a minute ago, that you wanted to find out for information. What were you going to do with the information when you found out about it?
A. I had no idea at all about it.
Q. And yet you stopped and asked him that question, and he said he didn't know anything about it; and you dont re-
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member what Rawley said, or what the other man said? A. No, sir.
Q. But you do remember what Davis said? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And that may be an impression on your mind? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, whom did you tell that to afterwards? A. I didnt tell it to any person.
Q. You never told it to a soul? A. Oh, yes; I did.
Q. Whom did you tell it to? A. My side partner.
Q. Who is he?
A. James Mulligan. Q. Is he in court? a. No, sir.
Q. Iutside? A. No, sir.
Q. He isn't here at all? A. No, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Was James Mulligan present when the conversation occurred?
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A. No, sir.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Well, was there anybody behind the bar assisting you? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, did you tell anybody else besides Mulligan? A. Yes, sir; I told Patrick Donnelly.
Q. Now, you are working for the Donnellys? A. Yes, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q. And has worked in the same saloon for the last three months, he says. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Now, do you remember yesterday morning your being in 28th Street, near 8th Avenue, with Patrick Donnelly and a man by the name of Thomas Carroll?
A. I was in the saloon.
Q. Do you remember being in 28th Street with those men yesterday morning, about 9 o'clock? A. Not on 8th Avenue; not on 28th Street.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, were you with those two men? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, where were you together? A. On 8th Avenue.
Q. Where?
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A. On 8th Avenue and 28th Street. Q. On 8th Avenue and 28th Street? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Out on the street?
A. Yes, sir; on the avenue.
Q. Were you on the avenue? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, then, you were together? A. Yes, sir.
Q. With those two other men? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR MCINTYRE.:
Q. It was about 9 o'clock, yesterday morning; was it not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, do you remember talking about this case then to these people? A. No, sir.
Q. You didn't say a word, yesterday morning, about the case? A. Not to those people.
Q. Well, who were you talking to yesterday morning about the*** case? A. I was not talking to any person about the case.
q Well, what were you doing with Patrick Donnelly yesterday morning? A. I was on the cars with him.
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A. On 8th Avenue and 28th Street. Q. On 8th Avenue and 28th Street? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Out on the street?
A. Yes, sir; on the avenue.
Q. Were you on the avenue? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, then, you were together? A. Yes, sir.
Q. With those two other men? A. Yes, sir.
BY MR MCINTYRE.:
Q. It was about 9 o'clock, yesterday morning; was it not? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, do you remember talking about this case then to these people? A. No, sir.
Q. You didn't say a word, yesterday morning, about the case? A. Not to those people.
Q. Well, who were you talking to yesterday morning about the*** case? A. I was not talking to any person about the case.
q Well, what were you doing with Patrick Donnelly yesterday morning? A. I was on the cars with him.
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Q. Well, he came after you, to bring you down to testify; didn't he? A. (No answer.)
Q. Didn't he?
A. To bring me down where? Here? Q. Yes.
A. I came down myself.
Q. Well, what were you doing with Patrick Donnelly yesterday morning? A. (No answer).
BY THE COURT:
Q. Dont you remember what you did yesterday morning? BY MR HOUSE:
Q. Didnt you come to my office?
THE COURT: Wait a moment, Mr. House.
A. I went with Patrick Donnelly and Carroll down to Mr. House's office. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Well, now, you remember that? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And yet that occurred only yesterday morning? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Yet you couldnt remember it a moment ago, but you can
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remember that you heard Davis say, some time ago, that he knew nothing about this case? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, didnt you rehearse your testimony yesterday morning with Donnelly and Carroll, and didn't you go over then the facts that you proposed to testify to in this trial?
A. I rehearsed it in Mr. House's office.
Q. You rehearsed it in Mr. House's office? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And how long were you rehearsing it in Mr. House's? A. About three minutes..
Q. About three minutes? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, was that the first time that you ever told Pat***rick Donnelly about it? Q. When did you tell him about it before?
A. The night before.
Q. The night before last? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Not before that
A. No, sir.
Q. Never said a word to him before that?
A. No, sir; never said a word to himprevious.
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Q How long have you been working for the Donnellys? A. Between 3 and 4 months.
Q. What were you doing before? A. Tending bar.
Q. For whom?
A. For Mrs. Donnelly; 33rd Street and 7th Avenue. Q. Mrs. Donnelly?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, is that one of the Donnelly ***family here? A. She was married to one of them.
Q. Yes; she belonged to the Donnellys here?
A. I don't know whether she is any relation or not; the husband was. Q. Well, what did you do before that?
A. I attended bar previous. Q. For whom?
A. For Peter McGirr.
Q. Where is his place of business? A. 37th Street and 11th Avenue.
Q. Well, is he any relation to the Donnellys? A. No,, sir.
Q. How long did you work for him?
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A. Six months.
Q. And whom did you work for before that? A. Joseph McSorley.
Q. Who?
A. Joseph McSorley. Q. As a bartender? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, this Thomas Rawley---He hangs out in 28th Street and 8th Avenue, in that liquor store; doesn't he? A. He be's around there once in a while.
Q. He is around there a good deal; isn't he? A. Well, he be's there pretty near every day. Q. In the day time?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now, he doesn't work, that you know of; does he? A. Yes, sir; he works.
Q. What does he do?
A. He was working there steady, cleaning up. Q. Then, he works or the Donnellys?
A. Yes, sir; he isn't working there now.
Q. Well, when did he stop working there? A: About two weeks ago.
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Q. And did he leave there?
A. Well, he left, or else got discharged; I couldn't tell you. Q. And is he working anywhere now?
A. No.
Q. Well, did he merely clean up the place?
A. Yes, sir; he attended to the lunch-counter and got up the lunch. Q. And was he paid regularlyor did he get an occasional drink?
A. No, sir; he was paid regularly.
Q. Do you know how much salary he got? A. Yes, sir; $5.00
A week.
THOMAS CAHILL, called by the defense, ***beingbduly sworn, testified as follows: Direct - Examination.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. Now, whereabouts do you live, Mr. Cahill? A. In 17th Street.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Where do you 1ive? A. 253 West 17th Street.
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BY MR. HOUSE:
Q. What is your business, Mr. Cahill? A. Coach driver.
Q. For whom?
A. Mr. Farrell, 8th Avenue and 33rd Street.
Q. Do you know a young man by the name of Patsey Kiernan? A. Yes, sir.
Q. You have seen him a good many times; have you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you remember that, about two weeks ago, you were on the corner of 28th Street and 8th Avenue? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you see Kiernan there? A. Yes sir.
Q. Was it in the day time or night time? A. Around half-past 7 o'clock at night.
Q. Did you have***any conversation with him?
A. Only he asked me, "Who is inside?" And I said, "Mr. Donnelly." And he said, "I have got a subpoena to come down here, and I know nothing about this" he says.
Q. And that is all? A. Yes, sir.
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Q. And you were at my office yesterday, weren't you? A. Yes, sir.
Q. With this other young man, Rafferty? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you saw this young man here, by my side? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And you made a statement to him? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And he took it down in writing? A. Yes, sir.
Cross-Examination. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. What is your business? A. Hack-driver.
Q. Who do you drive for? A. Mr. Farrell.
Q. Where is his place of business? A. 33rd Street and 8th Avenue.
Q. Keeps a stable there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. How long have you worked for him? A. About two years.
Q. And what did you do before that? A. I always drive a hack.
Q. Where do you live? A. In 17th Street.
Q. Are you married? A. No, sir; single.
Q. Now, have you ever been in Donnelly's place, at 28th Street and 8th Avenue? A. Yes, sir; once in a while.
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Q. Well, you drink there occasionally? A. Well, no.
Q. Well, don't you drunk at all? A. Well, yes.
Q. Well, then, don't you drink in there occasionally? A. Wel***l
yes.
Q. Well, when were you in there last? A. This morning.
Q. When, at what time?
A. Around about 5 o'clock.
Q. And whom did you see there? A. The bartender.
Q. Did you talk with him? A. No, sir.
Q. You didn't talk about this case at all? A. No, sir.
Q. Who is the bartender there? A. Frank Rafferty.
Q. And then the former witness, Rafferty, and you met, at 5 o'clock this morning? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And yet you never said a word about the Donnelly case? A. No, sir.
Q. And you never said that you were coming down to court to-day? A. No, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, now, what did Rafferty say to you? A. He didn't
352
Q. Well, you drink there occasionally? A. Well, no.
Q. Well, don't you drunk at all? A. Well, yes.
Q. Well, then, don't you drink in there occasionally? A. Wel***l
yes.
Q. Well, when were you in there last? A. This morning.
Q. When, at what time?
A. Around about 5 o'clock.
Q. And whom did you see there? A. The bartender.
Q. Did you talk with him? A. No, sir.
Q. You didn't talk about this case at all? A. No, sir.
Q. Who is the bartender there? A. Frank Rafferty.
Q. And then the former witness, Rafferty, and you met, at 5 o'clock this morning? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And yet you never said a word about the Donnelly case? A. No, sir.
Q. And you never said that you were coming down to court to-day? A. No, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, now, what did Rafferty say to you? A. He didn't
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say anything.
Q. Nothing at all? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, what did you say to Rafferty? A. I didnt say anything either.
Q. Neither of you opened your mouth? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, when did you start from this place? A. I started down about half-past 10.
Q. Well, then, from about 5o'clock in the morning until about 10 what were you doing? A. I was after getting done with a call.
Q. Well, you were in the store at 5 o'clock or about that time? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And how long did you remain in the store? A. About half an hour.
Q. Did you make any appointment to go back, and meet Rafferty again? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, did you go back? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, where did you meet Rafferty? A. Down here.
Q. Well, is that the first place you met him?
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A. Well, several places before I have met him.
Q. Well, we are talking of this morning. Was it this morning? A. Yes, sir; this morning.
Q. Well, you met Rafferty about 5 o'clock in Donnelly's store? A. Yes, sir.
Q. In the store? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Or out on the street? A. In the store.
Q. Now, you remained there how long? A. About half an hour.
Q. Well, now, did you and Rafferty talk about this case at all? A. No sir.
Q. Did you have any conversation at all? A. No, sir; we only met down here.
Q. No***. I didnt ask you about the meeting down here. Did you have no conversation whatever with Rafferty; do you mean that?
A. Yes, sir.
354
A. Well, several places before I have met him.
Q. Well, we are talking of this morning. Was it this morning? A. Yes, sir; this morning.
Q. Well, you met Rafferty about 5 o'clock in Donnelly's store? A. Yes, sir.
Q. In the store? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Or out on the street? A. In the store.
Q. Now, you remained there how long? A. About half an hour.
Q. Well, now, did you and Rafferty talk about this case at all? A. No sir.
Q. Did you have any conversation at all? A. No, sir; we only met down here.
Q. No***. I didnt ask you about the meeting down here. Did you have no conversation whatever with Rafferty; do you mean that?
A. Yes, sir.
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Q. And where did you meet Rafferty after that? A. Down here.
Q. In the court?
A. Yes, sir; outside.
Q. you didn't come downtown with him? A. No, sir.
BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Why didn't you come downtown to Mr. House'***ss office, with Rafferty, this morning? A. So I did, but not this morning.
Q. Was it yesterday morning? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, when did you see Rafferty before yesterday?
A. I seen him up on the Avenue, 8th Avenue and 33rd Street. Q. When?
A. Day before yesterday. Q. What time?
A. Well, I can't say exactly the time. Q. In the morning?
A. No; in the evening.
Q. And that was before you went to Mr. House's office? A. Yes, sir.
Q. And did you tell him that you were going to Mr. House's office? A. Well, we all went together there.
BY THE COURT:
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356
Q. "We all went." who went? A. Mr. Rafferty.
Q. And who else? A. Mr. Donnelly. Q. And who else?
A. Mr. Haigh, and myself and Mr. Rafferty. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Mr. Haigh?
A. Mr. Walter Haigh.
Q. And he is one of the witnesses here; is he? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you hear what he said there? A. No, sir.
Q. You don't know what he will testify to? A. No, sir.
Q. Now, do you remember, yesterday morning, being with Frank Rafferty and Patrick Donnelly, about 9 o'clock, in 28th street, near 8th Avenue, about. 9 o'clock?
A. About 9 o'clock? Q. Yes?
A. I guess it was a little late than that. Q. How much later?
A. About half an hour later. Q. Well, you all met there? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where?
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A. At 28th Street and 3th Avenue. In the store?
A. Yes, sir; in the store.
Q. And where did you go to then?
A. We came down here to the lawyer's office.
Q. And when you met in the store, yesterday morning, you and Patrick Donnelly and Rafferty, did you talk about what you were going to testify to?
A. No sir.
Q. Never said anything about it? A. No, sir.
Q. Did you know what you were going down to Mr. House's office for? A. Yes, sir; to see the lawyer.
Q. Well, but you didn't know what you were going to testify to? A. Well, everybody knew what he was going to say himself.
Q. You didn't say to Rafferty," Well, I am going to say about two weeks ago, that I heard Kiernan say that he didn't know anything about it"?
A. No, sir; I never mentioned a word.
Q. And Rafferty didn't say, "About three or four weeks ago, I heard Davis say that he knew nothing about it"?
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358
A. No, sir; he didn't say that to me.
Q. Now, did you tell Donnelly what you were going to testify to? A. No, sir.
Q. Well, to whom did you tell what you say you heard Kiernan say? A. Well, I told Mr. Donnelly
Q. When did you tell him?
A. I guess it was about Tuesday I told him.
Q. Now, where was this conversation that occurred between you and Kiernan? A. 33rd Street and 8th Avenue; the other store.
Q. And have you known Kiernan very long? A. No, sir; not very long.
Q. Well, would you know him if you saw him again?
a. Certainly I would.
Q. Where did you make his acquaintance? A. In the 28th Street store.
Q. And when did you make his acquaintance there? A.
A couple of months or so ago.
Q. And on 33rd Street and 8th Avenue you had this conversation?
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359
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was it in the evening?
A. Yes, sir; on Saturday night, about half-past 7 or 3 o'clock, at night. Q. And how did you come to talk about the Donnelly case?
A. I didn't speak to him about it; he talked to me a*** about it. Q. Well, what did he say?
A. Well, he said, "I have got a subpoena to go down bit I don't know nothing at all about the case." Q. And, after he told that what did you say?
A. I didn't say nothing. BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, what did you do?
A. I went in and told Mr Donnelly about it. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Well, why did you go in and tell Donnelly about it? (Objected to.) (Allowed.) (Exception.)
A. Well, there was no use of interfering, when he didnt know anything about it. Q. I say, why did you go in and tell Donnelly about it?
359
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Was it in the evening?
A. Yes, sir; on Saturday night, about half-past 7 or 3 o'clock, at night. Q. And how did you come to talk about the Donnelly case?
A. I didn't speak to him about it; he talked to me a*** about it. Q. Well, what did he say?
A. Well, he said, "I have got a subpoena to go down bit I don't know nothing at all about the case." Q. And, after he told that what did you say?
A. I didn't say nothing. BY THE COURT:
Q. Well, what did you do?
A. I went in and told Mr Donnelly about it. BY MR. MCINTYRE:
Q. Well, why did you go in and tell Donnelly about it? (Objected to.) (Allowed.) (Exception.)
A. Well, there was no use of interfering, when he didnt know anything about it. Q. I say, why did you go in and tell Donnelly about it?
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360
A. Why did I go in and tell him? Q. Yes?
A. Well, I don't know. Q. You don't know? A. No, sir.
Q. Where did you go to tell Donnelly? A. Up, in 33rd
Q? Where?
A. 33rd Street and 8th Avenue. Q. In his store?
A. Yes, sir; Mr. Donnelly's store. Q. Whose store?
A. Mr. Felix Donnelly.
Q. Well, that is 28th Street? A. No, sir; he has two stores.
Q. Well, did you go right away and tell Felix Donnelly about this conversation? A. No, sir; I told Patrick Donnelly first.
Q. You told Patrick Donnelly first? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Right after the conversation was had? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, how soon afterwards? A. Well, an hour, I guess, or so.
Q. Well, why did you go and tell him? Now, I want a specific answer to that? A. Well, I***mdont know.
360
A. Why did I go in and tell him? Q. Yes?
A. Well, I don't know. Q. You don't know? A. No, sir.
Q. Where did you go to tell Donnelly? A. Up, in 33rd
Q? Where?
A. 33rd Street and 8th Avenue. Q. In his store?
A. Yes, sir; Mr. Donnelly's store. Q. Whose store?
A. Mr. Felix Donnelly.
Q. Well, that is 28th Street? A. No, sir; he has two stores.
Q. Well, did you go right away and tell Felix Donnelly about this conversation? A. No, sir; I told Patrick Donnelly first.
Q. You told Patrick Donnelly first? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Right after the conversation was had? A. Yes, sir.
Q. Well, how soon afterwards? A. Well, an hour, I guess, or so.
Q. Well, why did you go and tell him? Now, I want a specific answer to that? A. Well, I***mdont know.
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361
Q You don't know?
A. No, sir; not exactly.
Q Well, did you regard it as important? A. Well, I ***don't know.
Q Well, what did Mr. Patrick Donnelly say to you then? A. He told me to come sown here; that is all.
Q He told you to come down here? A. Yes, sir.
Q To come where, to this court-house? A. Yes, sir.
Q He didn't toll you to go to Mr. House's office?
A. I went to Mr. House's office first***m and then I came here.
Q And you perceived the importance of that testimony, just as soon as Mr. Kiernan spoke to you about it, and told you that he ***didn't know anything about it? You regarded it as important, and you ran right off to Mr. Donnelly and told him?
A. No, sir; I ***didn't. He asked me and I told him.
Q Now, give me the exact language that you used when you went in and told Mr. Patrick Donnelly. A. I told him what I knew that is all.
Q ***Now tell me what you said to him.
361
Q You don't know?
A. No, sir; not exactly.
Q Well, did you regard it as important? A. Well, I ***don't know.
Q Well, what did Mr. Patrick Donnelly say to you then? A. He told me to come sown here; that is all.
Q He told you to come down here? A. Yes, sir.
Q To come where, to this court-house? A. Yes, sir.
Q He didn't toll you to go to Mr. House's office?
A. I went to Mr. House's office first***m and then I came here.
Q And you perceived the importance of that testimony, just as soon as Mr. Kiernan spoke to you about it, and told you that he ***didn't know anything about it? You regarded it as important, and you ran right off to Mr. Donnelly and told him?
A. No, sir; I ***didn't. He asked me and I told him.
Q Now, give me the exact language that you used when you went in and told Mr. Patrick Donnelly. A. I told him what I knew that is all.
Q ***Now tell me what you said to him.
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362
A. I toll him that I met Mr. .Kiernan and what he said to me, I toll him about it.
Q Did you over talk to Kiernan before in your life?
A. Well, not much.
Q At any time before in your life? A. Well; very little.
Q Well, will you tell me something that he said to you on any other occasion? A. Well, he said nothing to me.
Q Well what did he say? Nothing at all? A. Well, only how things is.
Q Anything about this case whatever? A. No, sir.
Q You can't remember any other conversation that he ever had with you? A. Not exactly. I didn't have any conversation with him at all.
Q No other conversation whatever? A. No, sir.
Q On this occasion a man that you never before had a conversation with came up to you and told you that he knew nothing about the Donnelly case, and you want us to believe that?
A. Well, that is as far as I know.
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363
Re Direct Examination. By Mr. House:
Q Now, you were interrogated by the District Attorney and asked about yesterday, if you were not with Patrick
Donnelly, and Cahill and Rafferty, about 9 o'clock, and you say you think it was a little after? A. Yes, sir.
Q And you vent right out and got on an Eighth avenue car? A. Yes, sir.
A. Yes, sir; and went right over to your office.
Q And Mr. Haight rode down with you; ***didn'tehe? A. Yes, sir.
WALTER HA***T; called by the Defense, being duly worn, testified as follows: Direct Examination.
By Mr. House:
Q Where do you live, Mr. Haight? A. 552 Broome street.
Q What is your business at present? A. Clerk.
Q For whom?
A. For the -- for Mr. Anderson, 169
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364
Eighth avenue.
Q You know James Donnelly, the defendant? A. I do, sir.
Q Do you know the premises at 28th street and Eighth avenue, the liquor store where this shooting occurred? A. Yes, sir.
Q Did you know Charles Madden, in his life time? A. I did.
Q Now, did you meet Mr. Patrick Donnelly, Mr. Cahill, and Mr. Rafferty yesterday morning, around about 9 o'clock?
A. Yes, sir.
Q And you took an Eighth avenue horse car? A. Yes, sir.
Q And where did you get off? A. We went to your office.
Q You went to my office? A. Yes, sir.
Q That was yesterday morning? A. Yes, sir.
Q Do you remember seeing this young gentleman here (Mr. House indicates his clerk)? A. Yes, sir; I do, sir.
Q And you made a statement; did you not? A. Yes, sir.
Q And did lie take it down in writing? A. He did.
Q Now, Mr. Knight, about three days before this shooting, were
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365
you coming through 28thstreet, from Seventh avenue going to Eighth avenue? A. I was, sir.
Q About what time of day was it?
A. Well, probably it would be between 8 and 9 o'clock in the evening, as I should budge.
Q Is there a stable in that street?
A. Yes, sir; two or three.
Q Well, did you see Madden that right? A. Yes, sir.
Q Where did you see him standing?
A. I saw him standing opposite the stable door in which he worked.
Q Was there any one else with him?
A. Yes, sir; another young man.
Q Who was it?
By the Court:
Q Bo you know his name?
A. No, sir; ***I didn't know the other party. He was a strange. by Mr. House:
Q Now, as you passed, did you see anything in Madden's hands?
A. As I walked down the street, I saw the other party with a pistol in his hands. By the Court:
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366
Q The other party, whose name you don't know?
A. Yes, sir; and just as ***I was in the act of passing, he handed it to Madden, and Madden put it in his hip pocket, in his right hand hip pocket, here (indicating).
By Mr. House:
Q In his right hand hip pocket? A. Yes, sir.
Q And that was three or four days before the shooting? A. Yes, sir.
Cross Examination. By Mr. ***Mclntyre:
Q You said you were a clerk? A. Yes, sir.
Q How?
A. Yes, sir.
Q Who are you a clerk for?
A. I am going to work for Mr. Anderson. Who is he?
A. 169 Eighth avenue.
Q What?
A. 109.
Q Well, 169 what? A. Eighth avenue.
Q Now, what sort of a business does he carry on, Mr. Anderson? A. He is a tea merchant there.
Q Has ho a store there? A. Yes, sir.
Q Well, do you act as a clerk there? A. Well, I am
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367 going to.
Q When?
A. Directly I get through with this business, sir, I hope.
Q Well, have you been a clerk for him?
A. Yes, sir.
Q For how long?
A. I worked for him three or four or five years.
Q Well, who else has he employed there, besides you? A. Well, he has five or six persons.
Q Now, how long is it since you have worked there as a clerk? A. Four or five years.
Q No. Since you worked there as a clerk? By the Court:
Q Are you working there now? A. No, sir; not at present.
Q Well, when did you work last for him?
A. About six years ago five or six years ago.
Q Well, you have not worked for Andersen during that five or six years? A. No, sir; I have not.
By Mr. Mclntyre:
Q Well, now, you stated to me and to Mr. House, and I believe that the Jury understood you to say that you were a clerk for Mr. Anderson?
A. Oh no; not at present.
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368
Q Wall, I want to know if you didn't say that, in your direct - examination? A. Well, then, it is a mistake.
Q That is a mistake?
A. Yes, sir, that's a mistake. I am going there, when I get through here.
Q Well, you are going to go to work for Mr. Anderson, when you get through the trial? A. Yes, sir.
Q And you have not worked for him for six years? A. No, sir.
Q Now, has Mr. Anderson employed you? You swear that he has Employed you to go to work at the termination of this trial?
A. No, sir, he hasn't.
Q No?
A. No; I won't say that.
Q Well, you bald, a moment ago, that you were going to work for Mr. Anderson at the conclusion of this Trial? A. Well, I presume that I urn going to do it.
Q Well, then, it is a mere presumption on your part? A. Yes, sir; a mere presumption.
Q Is it not a me$$es presumption about this pistol that you saw in soot body's hands? A. No, sir, it is not.
Q Well, what have you been doing for five or six years?
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369
A. Working in the ice business.
Q For whom?
A. Mr. Winch.
Q Where is that? A. 521 West 21st.
Q How long did you work for Winch? A. Last Summer.
Q Only during the summer?
A. In the season; that's all, sir.
Q And that was only last summer? A. Yes, sir.
Q Now, I want to get same thing about your history, from the time you left Anderson's place down to the time that you saw this man with the pistol in his hand. Now, commence with the time that you left Anderson?
A. Well, I could give you a pretty good idea of who I worked for, sir. I will have to just collect my thoughts a little bit.
Q No, don't disconnect them?
A. I didn't say disconnect them. Well, I have been working in the furniture business, with D. O. Farrell.
Q Where did you work for him?
A. I can't give you the date.
Q And how long?
A. Three or four months, at 31st street and Eighth avenue.
Q And why did you leave Mr. Farrell?
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370
A. Well, I neglected my duties.
Q And he discharged you?
A. No, sir.
Q Well, how did you neglect your duties?
A. Well, I failed to show up, one morning, and he put another man in my place.
Q Well, then, you were discharged?
A. Well, you can put it that way, sir, if you like.
Q Well, he didn't run around for you, to come back; did he? A. No, sir, he didn't.
Q And you worked for Mr. Farrell for a couple of months?
Q Now give me another man's name?
A. Well, it is longer than that; and I worked for Mr. J. J. Coogan, on the Bowery.
Q Well, when did you work for him?
A. Well, that was previous to Farrell's. That was same time ago, sir. By the Court:
Q Well, how long ago did you work or Mr. Coogan? A. Well, about four years ago, sir.
Q And how long ago is it since you worked for Farrell? A. Well, I guess it is about three years ago.
Q About three years ago? A. Yes, sir.
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371
By Mr. Mclntyre:
Q And how long did you work for Coogan?
A. I guess I was with him three or four months.
Q You guess you were with him three or four months? A. Yes***m sir.
Q And did he discharge you? A. No, he did not, sir.
Q Well, why did you leave him? A. Because I didn't snow up.
Q You didn't show up'
A. no, sir. I claimed to be sick.
Q And he put another man in your place?
A. No, sir, he didn't. In fact, the business was slow and I claimed sickness, and he told me I could stay away.
Q Well, you worked for Coogen and you didn't show up, and business was rather slow, and he told you that you needn't come any mo$$e?
A. Yes, sir.
Q And then he discharged you?
A. Well, if you like to pot it that way, you can.
Q Well, I will put it that way?
A. All right.
Q Now, please give me the name of some other person that you worked for? A. Well, I worked for Mr. Glascow, the summer before.
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372
Q When did you work for him? A. The previous summer.
By the Court:
Q How many years ago is that?
A. That is two years ago this summer. By Mr. Mclntyre:
Q Now, what is his name? A. Glascow.
Q And how lone, did you work for Glascow?
A. I worked for than during the summer season.
Q What was the character of the business carried on? A. Ice business.
Q And that is the man that Collins worked for? A. The same party.
Q And how long did you work for him? A. During the season.
Q And next where did you work?
A. And then I was out of work six or seven months.
Q Now, give me the name of some one else that you worked for?
A. Nothing that would be worth any mention, that I can recollect. I worked for odd people, doing add jobs for them. That was all, sir.
Q Well, the only three people that you can call to mind now,
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373
the only four, that you have worked for in a period of six years, are Glascow, D. O. Farrell, Coogan and
Winch?
A. Yes, sir; I guess that's about ail.
Q And you worked for Coogan three months? A. Yes, sir.
Q For Farrell about two months? A. Yes, sir.
Q And Glascow for the season, four or five months? A. Yes, sir.
Q And Winch?
A. About four or five months.
Q So that, for about six years, you have worked about thirteen months in all? A. Yes, sir, you may say that, about that.
Q Wow, what have been your means of support?
A. Well, I have friends in the old country, sir, that send me a remittance ***once in a while.
Q You have friendsin the old country that send you a remittance once in a while?
A. Yes, sir.
Q What part of tile old country? A. They are in England, sir.
Q Well, during the time that you haven't been doing anything, during the past five or six years, you were an habitual frequenter of Donnelly's place***s on 28th street and Eighth avenue; weren't you?
A. Yes, sir; I may say that I
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Q And you used to go in there and get a drink occasionally? A. Yes, sir.
Q And you became familiar with the defendant at the bar here; didn't you? A. No more familiar than anybody else.
Q Well, you were friendly with him, and familiar with him? A. Yes, sir; as a bartender and a customer.
Q And you could go in there, from time to time, and, as they call it, in the common parlance of the day, and hang up a drink; couldn't you?
A. Well, I don't know: I have done such a thing.
Q And this man at the bar gave you such credit, ***ram time to time?
A. Well, seldom, sir. I couldn't get the second one, unless I paid for the first.
Q Well, did you pay for the drinks out of the remittances that you got from the other side? A. Yes, sir.
Q Well, how frequently are those remittances made, and what do they amount to? By the Court:
Q When did you get the last remittance?
A. Well, I have had no necessity to send for one, sir.
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Q (Question repeated)?
A. About nine months ago, sir.
Q And where did it come from?
A. from my father, John Haight, sir.
Q From what part of England?
A. From Leicester. By Mr. ***Mclntyre:
Q Well, for the last four or five months can you tell me any legitimate work that you have been doing? A. No, sir, I can't; for I belong to the great army of the unemployed.
Q You can't, because you belong to the great army of the unemployed? A. Yes, sir.
Q Oh, you have been hanging around Donnelly's saloon right along; haven't you? A. No, sir.
Q Well, for nine months you have not had a remittance from the other side? A. About that time, sir.
Q And you haven't had any money upon which to exist? A. Well, yes. I have done odd jobs occassionally.
Q Well, now, haven't you got money from Donnelly? A. No, sir.
Q Haven't you been promised remuneration to come here and testify? A. No, sir; emphatically, no, sir; I have not.
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Q And do you mean to say that you have not bean promised compensation to come here and give the testimony that you have given to-day?
A. No, sir, I have not.
Q Who has paid your expenses during the last four or five months? A. No, one, sir.
Q How have you existed?
A. I have existed the best way I could. I have had odd jobs for people, and I have made a little money.
Q Well, where do you live, now?
A. 552 Broome street.
Q In the City of New York? A. Yes, sir.
Q How long have you resided there? A. Well, about - probably, ton months.
Q Oh, tell me; you know.
A. I can't tell you exactly.
Q You can't?
A. No, sir, not to swear to it. I simply sleep there.
Q Have you a room there?
A. Yes, sir.
Q Where do you go, when you get up in the morning? You have a room there? How much do you pay for it? A. Sometimes I pay by the month, and same times by the week.
Q How much do you pay, when you do pay at all? A. $1.25 a week, I am supposed to pay for it.
Q Where do you get your meals? A. In a restaurant.
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Q And where do you get the money to pay for them? A. Well, If I earn any --------
By the Court:
Q Where do you get the money to pay for your meals?
A. Well, if I get an odd job, I pay for them; and, if not, I very often go without my meals. That's what I
have to do, and I have done it pretty often, too, and I can't do anything else. By Mr. Mclntyre:
Q Now, this man, Mr. Anderson, that you speak of; have you talked with Mr. Anderson recently, who keeps the store on Eighth avenue?
A. No, sir.
By the Court:
Q When did you see Anderson last? By Mr. ***Mclntyre:
Q When did you see him last? By the Court:
Q To speak to?
A. Well, I haven't seen Mr. Anderson personally, out I have seen his manager.
Q I asked you when you saw Anderson last?
A. The last time?
Q Yes, the last time?
A. To speak to him, do you mean, to
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address him?
Q Yes, to speak to him?
A. Well, I haven't seen him for a long time.
Q Well, how long?
A. Well, probably it is two or three years ago since I spoke to him.
Q Now, what is the name of the other man?
A. That I was speaking $$?
Q Yes?
A. Arthur Bennett. By Mr. Mclntyre:
Q When did you see Bennett last?
A. It was -- let me see -- I believe it was Monday morning, sir.
Q Monday morning of this week?
A. Yes, sir, of this week.
Q Now, is Bennett the manager up there? A. Yes, sir.
Q Are you swearing now positively that there was an inducement held out to you to go to work in that place on
Monday morning last? A. Yes, sir.
Q It is no presumption now? You swear to it positively? (Objected to)`(Objection sustained)
Q Now, have you seen anybody in Anderson's place since Monday morning? A. No, sir.
Q You have not? A. No, sir.
Q How long did you know Madden? A. About 12 months.
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Q How much? A. 12 months.
Q What sort of a looking man was Madden?
A. Well, I would call him a kind of tall -- kind of tallish, raw-boned sort of man. Q
A kind of tallish, raw-boned man?
A. Yes, sir; that is the kind of man I would call him.
Q Well, what is his height?
A. Well, taller than myself.
Q Well, you stand up?
A. Well, about five feet ten, or six feet.
Q Well, how many feet do you measure?
A. About five feet seven or seven and a half.
Q About five feet seven or seven and a half? A. Yes, sir.
Q And you think he was about six feet?
A. Yes, sir. Well, be was a pretty tall man.
Q Now, I want to get sane idea of his height from you. Mr. House: Well, he has told you.
Mr. Mclntyre: Now, don't interrupt me. I have this witness in custody. Mr. House: Well, if your Honor please, I object.
The Court: Just put the question, and do not answer until I rule.
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By Mr. Mclntyre:
Q I want Your estimate of his height?
Mr. House: Objected to, as already asked and answered. By the Court:
Q Now, can you state once more what was Madden's, height? Give us your best idea of what it was? A. Well, a should say it was five feet ten.
By Mr. ***Mclntyre:
Q And about his weight: can you state what his weight was? A. Well, that I couldn't say.
Q How?
A. Well, he was a big raw-boned fellow.
They are very deceptive sometimes. I never saw him weighed.
Q Yes. Now, just think once more and state whether you can state now whether he had any hair on his face? A. I think he had a clear face.
Q Now, which is it?
A. Well, yes; he had a clear face.
Q He had a clear face?
A. Yes, sir. I don't know whether he had a little bit of down for a mustache or not. Q
A little down for a mustache?
A. No; he shaved clean, I believe.
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Q Well, now, you want to change it? A. Eh?
Q Do you want to change it now?
A. No, sir; he had a clear face; he was clean shaven; that's what you would term it.
Q He had a clear face, he was clean shaven, and that is what you would term it?
A. Yes, sir.
Q Now, what was the color of his hair? A. I would term it light complexion.
Q I am speaking of his hair? A. Light, sir.
Q How light?
A. Wall, lighter than -- between the blond and the brown, I would say.
Q Between a blond and a brown?
A. Yes, sir; I would call it a light -- whit we would properly term it, light hair.
Q Yes; light in color?
A. Yes, sir.
Q Of course, it was not black? A. No, sir.
Q You are sure it was not black?
A. I wouldn't call it black, no, sir; certainly not.
Q Now, are you sure about it?
A. Certainly I an. It was not black.
Q Well, was it red?
A. No, sir.
Q Will you swear that it was not red; how? A. It was not red, sir.
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Q What?
A. No, sir, it was not.
Q Well, you would know a red head, if you saw it; wouldn't you? A. Well, I think so.
Q Don't you know that you would?
A. Well, sane people would call red what I would call fair.
Q Some people would call red what you would call fair? A. Yes, sir, I would term him a fair complexioned man.
Q About five feet ten, fair complexion, clean shaven; and you can't tell us his weight, you can't estimate it?
A. Well, as far as I could estimate it, it would be about 170 pounds.
Q About 170 pounds?
A. Yes, sir.
Q Well; now, when you -- where did you say you saw him on this night in question? A. Well, when the pistol-
Q Yes, this is the pistol episode? A. It was on 28th street.
Q What part of the street?
A. Right opposite the stable where he worked. He was standing on the side-walk.
Q Well, where?
A. Well, it was about 150 yards East from Eighth avenue, on the north side of the street.
Q $$n the north side of the way?
A. Yes, sir; and on
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the east side of Eighth avenue.
Q Between 7th and 8th; is that it? A. Yes, sir; between 7th and 8th.
Q Now, how was he dressed that night? A. He was standing in his shirt sleeves.
Q In his shirt sleeves?
A. He had a vest on; he had no coat on.
Q Standing in his shirt sleeves, with his vest on? Had he a hat on? A. Yes, sir; he had a hat on.
Q And you saw him there, in company with another man? A. Yes, sir.
By the Court:
Q Now, will you tell us, before we go any further, what day this was? A. This was either Tuesday or Wednesday.
Q It was either Tuesday or Wednesday? A. Yes, sir.
By Mr. Mclntyre:
Q In what month? A. In May.
Q Eh?
A. It was in May. By the Court:
Q What part of May?
A. Well, the latter part of May, about the last week. It was previous to the occurrence.
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By Mr. Mclntyre:
Q How?
A. This shooting affair occurred at the last of the week, I know. It was before that.
Q Now, do you know when the shooting occurred?
A. Yes, sir.
Q When?
A. It ***occurred on the 28th of May, sir.
Q It ***occurred on the 28th of May?
A. Yes, sir.
Q Well, how do your know it was the 28th of May? A. Well, I wasn't there when it was done.
Q (Question repeated)?
A. Welt, I know by the calendar.
Q Well, did you look it up this morning? A. No, sir.
Q Well, who told you it was the 28th of May?
A. I know it occurred on Sunday, and that was the 28th, sir.
Q Now, who told you that?
A. I don't know.
Q Well, what made that impression of your mind, so that you can carry it from that time to this, that the shooting occurred on May 28th?
A. Well, if you really want to know, I will tell you.
Q I do. I really want to know.
A. Well, I read it in the newspapers, this morning.
Q Well, now, is that all you know about the case, what you
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385
read in the newspapers, this morning? A. No, sir.
Q Now, how do you know that it was three or four days before the shooting that you saw Madden? A. Well, because I passed the remark to Donnelly, in the store.
Q When?
A. On the very night that I saw this man with the weapon in his hand.
Q You told the ***decadent at the bar that you saw Madden with the weapon in his hand? A. Yes, sir.
Q How long did you know Madden, about twelve months? A. Yes, sir, about twelve months.
Q Well, had you met him in the saloon? A. Yes, sir.
Q Well, had you ever heard of any trouble between Madden and Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q Well, why did you go and tell Donnelly?
A. Because I knew there was trouble between them, and I heard Madden threaten to do him up and finish him.
Q Whom did you hear that threat from?
A. From Madden.
Q When did you hear him make that threat? A. Oh, that was six months previous.
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Q You heard him say that he would do Donnelly up? A. Yes, sir.
Q Did you t$$ Donnelly that?
A. Oh, he was in the store at the time.
Q And you were in the store at the time, too? A. Yes, sir.
V And you didn't say anything about that on your direct-examination to-day? A. No, sir.
Q No. Mr. House didn't ask you that question? A. No, sir.
Q And you volunteer the statement now?
A. Well, you asked me if I heard of any trouble, between Donnelly and Madden, and I have to give it to you in that way, to explain the matter.
Q Now, six months before the killing of Madden, you want to say that you heard Madden say, in Donnelly's tore, that he would do this ***decadent up?
A. Yes, sir.
Q You want that to go on the record, too?
Q Now, did you ever see Madden after that?
A. Yes, sir, I seen him in the store; and I have known
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Donnelly to order him to get out of the tore; that he didn't want him in there.
Q And you have seen Donnelly order him out?
A. I have heard him order him out.
Q And you didn't say anything about that in your direct-examination; did you? A. I was not asked that question.
Q Did you tell Mr. House that, when you were communicating to him the facts of the case?
A. No, sir; I told him that I had seen altercations between them, and that was all. He didn't ask for particulars.
Q Well, did you tell Mr. House, in Mr. House's office, that, six months before, you heard Madden make a threat?
A. Yes, sir; and I think he will find it on the notes of my statement.
Q And you did tell Mr. House that, six months before, a threat was made, and on several occasions you saw
Donnelly order Madden out of the place?
A. Well, if you are speaking directly, I didn't see Mr. House at all; I saw his representative.
Q Well, his representative then?
A. Yes, sir.
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388
Q And you told Mr. House's representative all that?
A. Yes, air; and he abbreviated them and put them all on paper.
Q Yes. Now; as soon as you paused through 28th street that night and saw what you have related here, namely as to the pistol, you went right in to Donnelly and told him; did you?
A. Yes, sir.
Q And what did Donnelly say to you?
A. He said -- well, will you allow me to use the remark that he made?
Q Yes, why, of course.
A. Well, I went in and ordered a glass of beer, and I said to Donnelly, "Jimmy, you had better look out. I saw the fellow that you had trouble with, and he has got his pop-gun," and he laughed, and he says, "Oh, I guess not; I guess there will be no further trouble between us."
Q No. He was not at all afraid when you told him that? A. Well, he didn't appear to me to be so.
Q Well, he had no fear at all, from his actions and apparent conduct? A. Not at that time.
Q Well, you can answer me? A. No, sir, not to my thinking.
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389
Q And when you told him that, he did not go to the drawer and take out a revolver and put it in his pocket, or anything of that sort?
A. No, sir.
Q Well, how long did you remain in the store that night? A. About an hour.
Q And did Madden come in that night? A. Not while I was there.
Q Did you ever hear that he went in at all that night? A. No, sir.
Q Now, the man that Madden was with, that had the pistol, do you know who he was? A. No, sir.
Q Did you ever see him before? A. No, sir.
Q Did you ever try to find out who he was? A. No, sir; I didn't; I had no reason to do so.
Q No reason to do so?
A. No, sir.
Q Well, you stated, a minute ago, that you knew that there was bad blood between the two men, and you saw a revolver it Madden's hands, and you never went up to ascertain who gave the revolver to him?
A. No, sir. I didn't think it would cone to thism, this affair.
Q Well, you didn't think it was of any importance, to see a
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revolver passed from one man to another?
A. No, sir; I didn't think it would amount to anything.
Q Well, you hoard him say; six months before, that he would do him up? A. Yes, sir.
Q And you told Donnelly that you saw a pop-gun in his enemy's hands?
A. Well, I told him in a kind of jocular manner. I didn't think for a moment that anything would ever cane out of it -- just the same as I might tell you. I never dreamt for a moment that anything would occur.
Q Now, just about what time of day was it? A. It was in the evening, sir.
Q How late in the evening? A. About 8 o'clock.
Q Well, it was dark?
A. Well, it was getting dusky.
Q Getting dusky, about 8 o'clock, three or four days before the 28th of May? A. Well I should call so.
Q Well, you say it was getting dusky, about 8 o'clock at night, on or about the 28th day of May? A. Yes, sir.
Q Were they standing in the stable door? A. No, sir; on the side-walk.
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391
Q How far mere you from them?
A. I was coming down the street. I was about ten paces away from him.
Q You were coming down the street, and you were about ten paces away from him? A. Yes, sir.
Q And how were they standing; facing you?
A. Well, one was standing with his back to the stable door***
Q Who was standing with his bank to the stable door?
A. This friend of Madden's was standing with his back, and Madden was standing with his face towards Seventh avenue. They were forming what I would call a right angle between the two of them, and I was in this direction (illustrating).
Q Yes. And, at ten paces away, you saw him take a revolver out of his pocket? A. No, sir I didn't see him take it out of his pocket.
THE COURT: No; he said that he saw him hand there over to Madden, and he put it in his pocket. MR. ***McLNTYRE: yes, sir.
By Mr. Mclntyre:
Q You saw the other man hand Madden a revolver? A. Yes, sir.
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392
Q You say it was a revolver? A. Yes, sir.
Q Are you sure?
A. Well, as near as I could judge, from the appearance of it.
Q Well, how did it look?
A. Well, like that one (indicating the weapon on the District Attorney's table).
Q How large?
A. About similar to that one.
Q How?
A. I guess so.
Q Well, what pocket did the man take it out of?
A. Well, the other party had it in his hand and gave it to Madden, and he put it in his hip pocket.
Q And, as you came up, the other party had the revolver in his hand?
A. Yes, sir.
Q And gave it to Madden?
A. Yes, sir; and Madden put it in his pocket.
Q Did he have one hand or both hands on it? A. Only one, as I recollect.
Q And Madden put it in his hip pocket? A. Yes, sir.
Q Did Madden say anything to you? A. No, sir.
Q Didn't speak to you at all? A. No, sir.
Q What? A. No, sir.
Q Didn't salute you or recognize you at all?
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393
A. No, sir.
Q Why, you knew him for twelve months? A. Yes, sir.
Q And you passed a mm that you know for twelve months, and didn't speak to him? A. Well, I know a good many men ------
Q I say, you knew him for twelve months? A. Yes, sir.
Q And drank with him?
A. No, sir; I know him from caning into the store.
Q And you never said a word to him, as you were passing? A. No, sir.
Q And you never stopped and asked him what he was doing with the revolver? A. No, sir, I didn't, I passed on.
Q Passed right on?
A. Well, I never said anything to Madden at all.
Q Just as if that revolver didn't concern you at all? A. It didn't concern me.
Q Well, what did you mean, a minute ago, when you said that you went into Donnelly's place, and told him that you saw a pop-gun in his enemy's hands?
A. Well, I meant by that, as I told you before -- I said
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to Donnelly, in a jocular manner, "You had better look out. That friend of yours has a pop-gun."
Q In a jocular manner?
A. Yes, sir. I didn't mean anything by the remark. I didn't think any notice would he taken of it what ever. Not bring was meant by it, on my part.
Q No. Now, have you talked about this case to the Donnellys, since the imprisonment of this ***defendant? A. No, sir.
Q Never said a word? A. No, sir.
Q Never said a word?
A. Well, all that I said was, Mr. Donnelly asked me did I know anything pertaining to the case, and I told him, and he said, "Well, I wish you would go down to his lawyer's, and tell him what you know."
Q When did Donnelly tell you that? A. About a week ago, I guess.
Q A. week ago? A. Yes, sir.
Q Where did he tell you? A. On 8th avenue, sir.
Q Well, where?
A. On the corner of 28th street.
Q On the corner of 28th street? A. Yes, sir.
Q And 8th avenue? A. Yes, sir.
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395
Q What time of day was it?
A. It was in the morning, I guess.
Q How early?
A. About 11 o'clock.
Q About 11 o'clock? A. Yes, sir.
Q And what were you doing up there then?
A. Well, I was taking a walk around, seeing whether I could get anything to do, I suppose.
Q Well, you live down in Broome street?
A. Yes, sir.
Q Well, did you ever walk around Broome street, to see if you could get anything to do? A. Yes, sir.
Q And did you ever walk around the docks, on the west side? A. Yes, sir; and on the east side, too.
Q Well, which Donnelly did you speak to? A. Mr. Pat Donnelly:
Q Mr. Patrick Donnelly? A. Yes, sir.
Q And he said to you, "Can you tell me anything that will help James Donnelly?"
A. He asked me did I know anything about the case, and he says, "You ought to, being that you have been in and out of the saloon or a number of years, and you knew everybody," and I said -- I told him I didn't know very
mush, but little,
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396
and he Maid, "What you do know, you ought to go down and tell."
Q And he said, "You ought to know some thing about it. You have been in and around the saloon for a number of years?"
A. Yes, sir; about that.
Q And then you said that you would go down to the lawyer's office? BY THE COURT:
Q Now, can you tell me what kind of a day this was when you met those two people or saw those two people in
28th street near Eighth avenue?
A. What do you mean? As regards the weather, sir?
Q Yes?
A. Well, I believe it was a fair? evening.
Q Well, was it a wet night?
A. No, sir.
Q Well, was it a fine night?
A. No, sir; a kind of hazy night. There was a kind of cloudiness in the atmosphere. It wasn't raining at the time.
Q You are sure about that?
A. Yes sir; because the man was standing in his shirt sleeves, and I was carrying my coat on my arm at the time. I know that.
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397
Q Well, what took you up there at the time?
A. Well, I was taking a walk, as I generally did every night about that time.
Q What were you going up there? Just repeat that.
A. I was walking around; I was going to this saloon.
Q What saloon?
A. To 28th street.
Q Well, just mention the name of the saloon?
A. Well, 28th street, where the defendant was the bartender.
Q You were going there?
A. Yes, sir.
Q Then you just happened to passby?
A. No; I made it a regular calling place; I was there pretty near-----
Q No; I am talking of where you met those two men, and where you were within ten paces of than, you say? A. Yes, sir; I was passing though the street.
Q Now, I want to know what took you up there at that hour if the night, if you can recollect? A. Well, it was a ***practice of mine to call there every evening.
Q Well, you have no recollection then of anything calling you up in that neighborhood? A. No, sir; no more
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398
than to have a glass of beer.
Q Now, who else was there when you saw these two men and the pistol passed from one to the other? A. No one else.
Q No one except you and those two men?
A. No, sir; those two men were standing in the street, passed by.
Q Well, on the street, or up against the stable?
A. On the side-walk, sir.
Q By the stable?
A. Yes, sir.
Q And there vat no one else that you could see, except those two men and yourself? A. No, sir.
Q Now, what kind of a looking man was the other man? A.
A short, stockily built man.
Q
A young fellow?
A. Yes, sir; a youngish man.
Q You don't know his name? A. No, sir.
Q And you never saw him before?
A. No, sir, I never saw him before; but he looked to me to be a truckman.
Q He looked like a truckman?
A. Yes, sir; dressed like a truckman.
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399
THE COURT: Are you through with this witness? MR: ***McINTYRE: Yes, sir.
MR. HOUSE. Yes, sir.
THE COURT: Gentlemen, I am, ex-official a member of a great many Boards, and I find that there is to be a meeting to-day of the Sinking Fund Commissioners, and I must attend it, at the Mayor's office; and you will have, therefore, an opportunity to lunch, from 1 to 2 o'clock, and I will have no opportunity, except to
attend to some public business. Please bear in mind the Statutory admonition, to which I have already called four attention.
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400
AFTERNOONSESSION.
JAMES DONNELLY, the defendant, being duly sworn, testified as follows: DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR, HOUSE:
Q Mr. Donnelly; take it easy and speak up loud so that this last gentleman can hear and then we all can. Your full name is what?
A James Donnelly.
Q How old are you Mr. Donnelly?
A Thirty-three years of age.
Q Where were you born?
A County of Tyrone, Ireland.
Q When did you come to the United States?
A In 1878--July 27.
Q On or about July 127th, 1878?
A Yes, sir.
Q When you came to this country, where did you land, Mr. Donnelly?
A I landed at 341 Eighth Avenue.
Q I mean did you come through Castle Garden?
A Yes--I didn't--I got off--
BY THE COURT:
Q You landed in New York?
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401
A Yes, sir.
THE COURT: That will do.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q You landed in New York City?
A Yes, sir.
Q Immediately after you landed in Mew York City where did you go?
A I went to my cousin's, Felix Donnelly.
Q Where was his residence?
A Corner of 27th Street and Eighth Avenue.
Q What business was he engaged in at that time?
A Liquor business.
Q Did you go to work for him then?
A Yes, sir,
Q At what store did you go to work for him?
A 27th Street and Eighth Avenue.
Q How long did you remain working there for him at that time at that store?
A I worked there until the year 1880.
Q And then where did you go?
A I went to work in the store 26th Street and Eighth avenue.
Q One of his stores?
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402
A One of his stores also.
Q How long did you work there?
A I worked there until 1891.
Q And then did you leave?
A I left then and I went to work for my brother who had started in business.
Q Where was his place of business?
A Corner of 28th Street and Ninth Avenue.
Q How long did you work for your brother?
A Until 1835.
Q And then when you left him in 1885 where did you go?
A I started in business for myself.
Q Where?
A 44th Street and Ninth Avenue.
Q How long did you continue in business for yourself?
A I continued in business for myself going on two years.
Q And then what did you do?
A I hadn't very good health then and I solid out to a man named ***Fitzwilliam's and I took a trip across to the old country.
Q How long did you stay in the old country on that trip?
A I stayed there about, I presume, three months and then
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came back.
Q And then you returned to New York again?
A Yes, sir.
Q Do you remember what season of the year it was that you returned?
A I returned in the latter part of September, 1887.
Q Upon your return did you go to work for anyone?
A I went to work in March, 1888 for a man named Barney Campbell.
Q How long did you work for him?
A Five or six months.
Q Did you leave his place?
A Yes, I was laid up with rheumatism.
Q After you recovered from your attack of rheumatism did you go to work for anyone?
A After I got recovered I went to work for my cousin at 33rd. Street and Eighth Avenue.
Q Felix Donnelly?
A Yes, sir.
Q That is the same man who owns the saloon at 28th Street and Eighth Avenue?
A Yes, sir.
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Q How long did you work for him at the 33rd. Street saloon?
A I worked for him until some time in July, 1891.
Q And then where did you go?
A He sent me down to the other store.
Q That in at the corner of 28th Street and Eighth Avenue?
A Yes, sir.
Q Did you remain in that store as a bartender down to the Sunday afternoon of May 28th, 1893?
A Yes, sir.
Q You were about seventeen years of age when you came to this country, were you not?
A Yes, sir.
Q Now, before you left Ireland and cane to this country ***had you ever been arrested or charged there with the commission of any crime?
A No, sir.
Q After you left Ireland and came to this country have you ever been convicted of a crime?
A Never, sir.
Q Now, from the time you first came to the City of New York down to the 28th day of May, 1893, Mr. Donnelly.
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had you ever been charged with the commission of any crime?
A Never, sir.
Q Have you at any time since you have been in the United States been convicted for the commission of any crime?
A I have not.
Q With the exception of your arrest for the shooting of Madden on the 28th day of May, 1893, have you ever been arrested for perpetrating physicial violence upon the person of any one?
A I have not sir.
Q You knew Madden in his lifetime, did you not?
A Yes, sir.
Q About how long had you known Madden prior to the afternoon of the shooting?
A I had known him about eighteen months.
Q When did you first become acquainted with Madden?
A In the 28th Street store.
Q From his coming in there?
A Yes, sir.
Q From his coming in alone?
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A Coming in with some other men.
Q Did you know where he was supposed to be working?
A Not first off. It was a long time before I found out. I knew him by his coming in with the others.
Q What were usually your hours, Mr. Donnelly, in this saloon at 28th Street and Eighth Avenue?
A I would come on at 10 in the morning and work until 2 in the afternoon and then go off at 2 and come on at 7 and close at one o'clock.
Q When Madden would come in the saloon and when you would see him, would it be in the day time or in the evening?
A I saw him sometimes in the day time but most generally it would be at night.
Q Do you mean it was his habit to lounge on the corner at 28th Street?
A Generally.
Q With other people in the neighborhood?
A Yes, that corner and the 27th Street corner.
Q And the 27th Street corner?
A Yes, sir.
Q Now, Mr. Donnelly, as near and as best you can will
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you describe Madden, his height, as you think, about his weight, and the color of his hair. Give us as fair a description of him as you can.
A I presume he was a man about five feet eleven.
Q Yes.
A He was a man who would weigh about one hundred and sixty pounds, a tall, large-boned man, not very fleshy and fair complexion and a clean face.
Q
A clean face?
A Yes, sir.
Q Did you ever see him intoxicated about the saloon?
A I have.
Q During the two years that he from time to time came into the saloon and was about that neighborhood, you observed his conduct, did you?
A Yes, sir.
Q What was his general conduct as regards being a quarrelsome man or not?
A He was always for raising a disturbance when he got a drink.
Q He Was always for raising a disturbance when he got a drink?
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A Yes, sir.
Q Now, at any time have you refused to sell him a drink?
A Yes, sir.
Q And at any time have you requested him to go out and remain out of the saloon?
A Yes, sir.
Q Now, can you fix about the first time that you ever refused to sell Madden a drink and told him to keep out of the place?
A The latter part of March.
Q What year?
A 1893.
Q You know this colored man Johnson, do you not?
A Yes, sir.
Q Were you present in the saloon on the night that the difficulty occurred between Madden and Johnson?
A Yes, sir.
Q Now, at any time during that night did Johnson pass the umbrella that was the subject of discussion over the bar to you?
A No, sir.
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Q At any time on that night did you see the umbrella which was the subject of that discussion behind your bar?
A No, sir.
Q When the young man came in did you see him with an umbrella?
A I did not notice it.
BY THE COURT:
Q What was the name of that young man?
A I do not know his name, your Honor.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q Were you present at the time of the difficulty between Madden and Tucker?
A Yes, the latter part of it.
Q At the time that Madden knocked Tucker down, as he has testified and as Butler as testified, down in the saloon, were you present?
A I was not present in the saloon at that time.
Q But you did know that there had been some trouble between Madden and Tucker?
A Yes, sir.
Q Now, do you know whether the trouble that occurred between Madden and Tucker was brought to the attention of
Mr. Felix Donnelly, your employer?
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A Yes, sir.
Q And in consequence of that, did Mr. Felix Donnelly give you any instructions?
A Yes, sir.
Q What were they?
A He instructed me not to sell him any more drink and ordered him to keep out of the place and for him*** to
go and spend his money some place else, that he had done damage enough in the place by cutting up this colored man and he said that he didn't want to have him come there.
BY THE COURT:
Q Did you communicate all that to Madden?
A Yes, sir.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q After you had first told Madden what you have just stated now do you recall whether for a time he remained away from the place?
A Yes, he remained away at that time for about two or three days.
Q Would that bring you down to about the fore part of April of last year?
A Yes, the beginning of April.
Q Now, do you recollect that at the beginning of April
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Madden came into the saloon when you wore behind the bar?
A Yes, sir.
Q Did you have any conversation with him?
A On what day?
Q The beginning of April 1893.
A Yes, he came in and he asked for a drink. I refused him and I told him that my boss had told me that he could have no more drink, that I had got instructions to keep him out of the place. He said that my boss couldn't keep him out of the place if he wanted to come in it.
Q And then what happened?
A There was two of his friends waiting--when he saw that I wouldn't give him a drink he said he would pull me out from behind the bar and with that two friends that was with him got him to go out--to go out of the side door at that time.
Q Mr. Donnelly, you heard Kiernan and Davis when they were on the stand the other day, did you not?
A Yes, sir.
Q You heard them testify that about five or six weeks before the shooting, which would be some time in the
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month of April, that they were coming down Eighth Avenue when Madden crawled out from under the swinging doors?
A Yes, sir.
Q And that they went around to the side door and came in and saw you behind the bar with a pistol in your hand?
A I had not sir.
Q Did you hear them testify to that?
A Yes, sir.
Q And did you then hear them say on the stand here that you said to them that you would shoot the cock-eyed son of a bitch on sight?
A I did not.
Q Did you hear them say that?
A Yes, sir.
Q Now, Mr. Donnelly, upon the occasion mentioned by Kiernan and by Davis, did you state to them or either of them that you would shoot the cock-eyed son of a bitch on sight?
A I never did, sir.
Q Did you ever in your life make a threat against Madden to Kiernan or Davis or to anyone else?
A I did not sir.
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Q Did you ever in your life make a threat to anybody that you would shoot the cock-eyed son of a bitch on sight?
A I did not.
Q Did you ever threaten in the presence of anybody to shoot Madden at any time?
A I have not.
Q Now, you heard Davis also testify that about a week after that occurrence, that he came into the saloon and in a conversation with you you said that you would shoot Madden the next time you saw him?
A Yes, I heard him say that.
Q And that he said he would not do that "Because you will only get yourself in trouble?" THE COURT: "It would be a very foolish thing for you to do."
Q Yes, and that you then replied, "Well, I would be justified in doing it?"
A I heard him say that.
Q Did you ever have a conversation of that kind with Davis?
A I did not sir.
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Q Did you ever have a conversation with Davis where you used words in substance as he used in his testimony yesterday?
A I have not sir.
Q You say that at no time, in no place and in the presence of no persons did you ever threaten to commit violence against the person of Madden?
A I did not.
Q Now, Mr. Donnelly in your own way, I want you to tell us what did occur upon the day that Kiernan and Davis testified to when Madden first came into the saloon, and all about it.
THE COURT: You mean now the 28th day of May?
MR. HOUSE: I am referring to the day that Kiernan and Davis said they were going down the Avenue when Madden crawled out from under the swinging doors.
A That was about the 5th or 6th of April--about the 5th of April. I
got to the store about four o'clock in the afternoon. The other bar-keeper went off. It was three hours
earlier than I was accustomed to go on. I got to the store about four o'clock and I was behind the bar when
Madden came in with two friends that came along
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with him.
BY THE COURT:
Q Did you know them?
A I did not know them--and he called for a drink. This was after I had refused him previous. That was the second visit after I had refused him and I told him he could have no drink and ordered him to leave the place. He says, "If you don't sell me a drink I will come in behind the bar and pull you from behind the bar and kick you all over the store" and used language so filthy that I am ashamed or it.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q Go on and tell your story and leave the language for the District Attorney if he wants it.
A Then I came from behind the bar and his two friends ran out and catched him and pulled him and got him to go out of the store at that time.
By THE COURT:
Q Now you are testifying about the second visit?
A Yes, sir.
Q I understood you to say there were two visits on that day?
A Yes, sir.
Q You have already testified about his telling You to
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come out from behind the bar. Was that on the first occasion or the second?
A No, it was previous, in March. This was in April.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q Go on.
A They got him out of the store then. That afternoon, between six and seven o'clock, he came back in alone and he came over to the bar and he struck it with his fist and said, "You are a son of a bitch if you don't sell
me a drink and I will kick you all around the store." I says, "I told you before you couldn't have a drink." I said, "I want you to get out of here, I don't want to have any more trouble with you; you have done damage enough in this place." And he struck the bar again and he says, "You can't put me out." He says, "You come from behind the bar and put me out if you are a man." With that Kiernan and Charlie Davis came in the side door and Kiernan walked up to him and took him by the shoulder "Let me get hold of the son of a bitch and I will kill him." And then Kiernan went around to the front door and says, "I don't want to be in a place where there is going to be any killing," and then Davis went out through the front door.
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Q Where was Butler at that time?
A He was by the front door. Madden came in and made a rush to the front of the bar and picked up a large iron cuspidor that was in front of the bar. That was the first I seen him have the cuspidor. I reached under the counter where the pistol was left and got it and I says, "If you fire that at me or strike me with it you wont
get out of this place--" He dropped the cuspidor and made off toward the door and he dropped on to the floor and made a dive on his knees through the folding doors.
I laid down the pistol.
Q Did you pint it at him?
A I didn't point it. I just held it in my hand. He turned around in the door-way and he says," I will get you, you son of a bitch, no matter who is with you. I will do you but not the same as Johnson, but I will make a
***corpose of you." At the same time Davis came in the aide door and walked over to the bar and Butler was talking to him in front of the door.
Q Now, did you see Madden again after that until the Sunday afternoon of the shooting?
A No, sir. I didn't see him until the Sunday when he
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came in on the 28th.
Q Before this day that you have just spoken of had Madden ever said to you or in your presence that he would do you any act of violence?
A Yes, sir.
Q When do you recollect was the first time when he threatened to do you any act of physical violence?
A In the latter part of March, after the first time I refused to sell him a drink.
Q Who was present at that time?
A The first time?
Q When he said that?
A They were two of his own friends whom I did not know--two friends of his own.
Q At what time was it and where was it that he said, "Jim, I'll do you up," when Hay was present?
A That was a week previous to the shooting. That was about the 21st.
Q When Hay told us it was about some six months before when he heard of that threat, he was mistaken?
A No, that was long ahead of this. That was away back some time. He had trouble with a man and struck the man
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and knocked his head through the panel of a door and I grabbed him at that same time and I told him to keep out. After we had had that trouble he came around and apologized and he said he wouldn't do anything of that kind again. That was a long while ahead of this trouble.
Q Now, come down to the Sunday of the shooting. What time did you go into the saloon that day?
A I got to the a tore about a quarter to four o'clock.
Q And when you entered the saloon, who did you find there?
A There was none in there but the other bar-keeper and Paddy Collins.
Q Didn't you see O'Keefe and Ruch at that time?
A No, sir.
Q They say they were in the saloon when you went in.
A They were standing at the side door--the up-side entrance of the storm door.
Q When you entered the saloon whereabouts was Collins standing, if you recollect?
A Collins was standing away at the far part of the bar--the end of the bar.
Q Around at the turn?
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420
A Yes, sir.
Q Near the Eighth Avenue entrance?
A Yes, sir.
Q Is that near where the cigar lighter was?
A Yes, it is between seven and eight feet away.
Q Do you know what Collins was doing at the time you came in. THE COURT: He says standing at the bar.
A Leaning across the bar reading a paper.
Q Were there some papers on the bar is front of him?
A All the days papers.
Q Who was in charge of the saloon at the time you entered?
A Thomas McCabe.
Q When you went in where did McCabe go?
A He unfastened his apron and went into the closet in the rear part of the store.
Q What did you do?
A I took off my coat and went behind the bar, and my hat, and put them into the closet and I opened the drawer and I took my apron out of it and I was tying the apron around me when Ruch and O'Keefe came in through the side
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door and came over to the bar and had some drinks. What it was I don't know.
Q Who served them?
A I served them.
Q Did you see Madden in the store at that time?
A No, sir. He was not in it yet.
Q That is, you had not seen him yet?
A No, sir.
Q Did you see Madden when he came into the store?
A I did not.
Q Whether Madden had been in the store before and gone into the closet, as some of the witnesses have testified, you don't know?
A I don't, sir.
Q When you entered that bar-room on that Sunday afternoon the 28th of May, you did not know where Madden was at the time?
A No, sir.
Q Now, when did you see Madden for the first time?
A I saw him about seven or eight minutes after those two came in. BY THE COURT:
Q Which two?
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A O'Keefe and Ruch.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q Where was he standing when you first saw him?
A He was coming from the rear part of the store.
Q Is there a side entrance to the rear part of the store?
A Yes, sir.
Q What were you doing at the time you saw Madden coming from the rear part of the store?
A I was putting soma soft stuff in the ice box back of the bar.
Q When Madden came up to the bar?
A Yes, sir.
Q Where did he come from first?
A These two people were sanding there and when I was putting my soft stuff in the ice box bock of the bar I saw Madden coming from the rear of the store. Whether he came from the street or from the rear of the store, I could not say. He came walking up to the bar and asked me for a drink.
Q What did you say?
A I said, "Haven't I told you you can't have any drink
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in here." I says, "I want you to gat out of here. He says, "I want you to come around her and put me out." And he walked up to the cigar lighter--the cigar, he had it in his mouth, and he putfire to the cigar and he came back. He came back where I was standing about the centre of the bar, right near the ice box back of the bar. He cays, "I went leave this place unless I get that drink." I replied and I says, "Haven't I told you you
couldn't get any drink here?" He says, "If you don't sell me a drink I will knock you down right where you stand." I says, "I want you to get out of here. You have damage enough already; have have cut a colored man here. You can't come in here." With that he says, Bam you, I'll fix you, "and going for his hip pocket--"
Q With which hand?
A His right hand.
Q Where was his left hand?
A In this form. (Indicating), Right opposite. That was the form in which he was standing, like that. (Indicating.)
Q When he said, "Dam you, I'll fix you," and put his hand to his hip pocket, what did you do?
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A He says, "Dam you, I'll fix you," and was going for his hip pocket, and as I had been threatened-- BY THE COURT:
Q Never mind. Tell us what you did as soon as you saw him go for his hip pocket.
A Fearing my life of him, and as he had threatened he would kill me, on the impulse of the moment I grabbed for the pistol and taking it in my hand I snapped the trigger without taking any aim. He threw up his hand and said, "I am shot" and held his arm in this manner (indicating) and turned from the bar.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q Now, Donnelly, at the time that Madden put his hand back to his right hip pocket and said, "Dam you, I'll fix you," did you fear that he was about to do some great bodily harm to you?
A Yes. I was afraid of my life.
Q Did you fear that at the time he intended inflicting upon you some great harm?
A I thought that was his intention.
Q Did you fear that at the time he put his hand back to his hip pocket that he intended to inflict some great injury upon you?
A I felt sure of it, yes.
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Q When you took the pistol in your hand, did you take any deliberate aim at him?
A No, sir.
Q Had you any intention when you fired to kill him?
A I did not.
Q Had you any desire or determination of killing him at that time?
A No, sir.
Q Did you ever contemplate in your life killing this man?
A I never did.
Q Had you ever formed in your life an intention to kill him?
A No, sir.
Q After he said, "I am shot," and went out, what then happened?
A In about a few minutes, five or seven, an officer came in and he went to arrest O'Keefe who was standing by the lower side of the door and he told him to throw up his hands, and he asked him if it was he who done the shooting and he said no, and he asked Collins if he done the shooting and he said no, and he asked me if I done the shooting and I told him the shooting was done
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by me in self defense-- that I did the shooting in self defense.
Q What did the officer say then?
A He said, "I will have to put you under arrest."
Q Did he?
A Yes, sir.
Q Where were you taken?
A To the 27th Street Station House.
Q On your way to the Station House did you see Madden?
A Yes, sir.
Q Where was he?
A He was lying on the cellar door, between the side door and the corner.
Q Were there many people about?
A Quite a crowd of people.
Q Were there any other police officers present?
A There were no other officers.
Q What did O'Neill say to Madden when you Were taken out of the saloon?
A He asked him was I the man that shot him.
Q What did Madden say?
A Madden said yes.
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427
Q Do you recollect going on your way to the Station House that you said anything to the police officer?
A Yes, sir.
Q What did you say?
Objected to. Objection sustained.
Q To whom did that pistol belong, Mr. Donnelly?
A That pistol was in the store before I came there. I don't know who owned it.
Q You had been in that store how long before the shooting?
A It might have been there ten years.
Q No, I ask you how long you had been in the store before the shooting, that is, as a clerk or a bartender?
A I was there from July, 1891.
Q From July, 1891 to May 28th, 1893?
A Yes, sir.
Q And you found the pistol there when you came there?
A Yes, sir.
Q Now, where did you get the pistol from this Sunday afternoon when you fired the shot?
A It was in the drawer.
Q How many drawers are there back of that bar?
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428
A There are four.
Q The bar is on the north side of the saloon?
A Yes, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q Which drawer did you get the pistol out of?
A It was the drawer next to the ice box. There was one drawer between that and Eighth Avenue.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q (Exhibiting diagram of the saloon to the witness.) Here is the bar; there is the ice box; this is Eighth Avenue. There are three drawers. Which one of the drawers was it?
A There were three drawers. This is the drawer it was in. BY THE COURT:
Q You say it was this drawer here?
A There were two large drawers directly over the ice box.
Q There were only two drawers then?
A Yes, sir.
Q It was the second of those, the one next to the ice box?
A Yes, the drawer next to the ice box.
BY MR, HOUSE:
Q You say there is only two drawers?
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429
A There are three.
THE COURT: I will mark the drawer that he points out as X, the one right next to the ice box.
Q Now, Mr. Donnelly, at the time you took that pistol out of the drawer and just before you fired, was the drawer closed or open?
A It was about half open. I was after taking my apron out of it.
Q When did you first open the drawer in which the pistol was that Sunday afternoon?
A I opened it for my apron after I came in.
Q And then you did not close it entirely after you took your apron out?
A I was tying the apron around me at the time Ruch and O'Keefe came in and I hadn't closed the drawer in consequence of waiting on them two.
Q What did you do, with the pistol after you had fired the shot, directly after?
A I had the pistol in my hand when Madden was going out of the store.
Q And then what did you do with it?
A I put it back in the drawer.
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Q Now, did you attempt to fire more than one shot at that time?
A No, sir. I didn't think that at the time the shot had entered his body. I thought it had only wounded his arm when I seen my life was in danger.
Q And you were under the impression at the time that he went out that the only wound that was inflicted upon him was in the arm?
A Yes, sir.
Q And that you had no idea or knowledge or information that the ball had entered his body?
A No, sir.
Q Mr. Madden--I beg your pardon, Mr. Donnelly, at any time after you had had that episode with Madden in which he took up the iron cuspidor to throw at you, after which he did not enter into the store again until the
Sunday afternoon of the shooting, did you see Madden any where on the Avenue or in the street?
A Yes. I have seen him on the corner coming and going. When I would meet him he would always turn to me and say--in fact, he threatened me and at one time he told me, "I'll put you where the dogs wont bite you; I will
not
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431
out you the way I out the coon." I used to meet him at times on the Avenue.
Q You were afraid of him after that?
A I dreaded my life of him. I always made it my business to keep out of his way. He said to me, "You are the cause, you son of a bitch--" "He is the cause of having me kept out of the place." He says, "I will get hunk with him yet."
BY THE COURT:
Q was this all said at one time?
A No, on different occasions.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q Now, after the shooting, you were taken to the Station House, were you not, Mr. Donnelly?
A Yes, sir.
Q How long were you locked-up?
A I was locked-up until the next morning.
Q And then where were you taken?
A To Jefferson Market.
Q Were you locked-up there?
A Yes, sir.
Q In the court for how long?
A I was there--I was kept down stairs for an hour or two and then I was sent up stairs and I was locked up
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for a week.
Q And at the end of the week you were liberated on bail? MR. McINTYRE: Objected to.
A Yes, I was.
MR. McINTYRE: This was before the man died.
THE COURT: I don't think that is right. Strike that out and I tell the Jury to disregard it.
Q Do you recollect when you were last arrested and taken to the police station? Objected to as absolutely immaterial.
THE COURT: Unless for the purpose of fixing some date in reference to some other matter which may have a bearing upon this, it is utterly immaterial. He is here on this indictment.
MR. HOUSE: Very well. Will you please give me the benefit of an exception?
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q How long have you known Patrick Donnelly?
A I have known him since I was a boy.
Q How long have you known Patrick Collins?
A I have known him about three years.
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Q Collins went in and out of the store that you attended bar in off and on for a period of two years or more before you were incarcerated?
A Not quite two years.
Q From the time that you first went there?
A Yes, I got an opportunity to know him there.
Q You knew that Collins witnessed the shooting of Madden?
A He was there.
Q He was standing at the end of the bar?
A Yes, sir.
Q What relation are you to Patrick Donnelly?
A I am a cousin of his.
Q Did you authorize Patrick Donnelly to offer Collins $400 and ask him to go to Ireland?
A No, sir.
Q In order to get away from the trial of this case?
A No, sir.
Q You did not authorize that?
A No, sir.
Q Do you know of any such offer being made?
A I know the man wanted to get money to go away and I
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wouldn't accept of it.
Q He came to get money to go away?
A Yes, sir.
Q Where did he say he wanted to go?
A He came to me in the Tombs.
Q You sent for him?
A I didn't.
Q What did you say to him in the Tombs?
A He came to the Combs and he started to cry and he said, ``I am sorry that I ever swore so falsely against you at the time I made the statement in the police court. I was pretty drunk then and I did not know what I. was saying.''
Q You say that Collins came to you in the Tombs and said to you, Donnelly, ``I am sorry that I swore falsely against you?
A Yes, sir.
Q Did he say what he was going to do?
A He did not.
Q Did you ask him?
A He said he was willing to try to do anything to get me out of it.
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435
Q What did you say?
A I said, ``I don't see how you can get me out of it unless you get yourself in trouble.''
Q You were unwilling then that he should come down here once more and give perjurous testimony because you feared that he Would get into trouble?
A Because he was--
Q You did not want him to tell any different story because you were afraid he would get into trouble?
A He was willing to accept the money if he could get it.
Q What was said about the money?
A He said he would take $400--that he had a wife to support and not a cent--he said, ``I am willing to take
$400 and get out of the way. It is the only way I can be a friend to you because I have made a statement and I
can not go back of it. The District Attorney will hold me to my statement.''
Q When had he this conversation with you?
Q In the Tombs.
Q When?
A That was in November.
Q Last November?
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436
A Yes, sir.
Q Isn't it a fact that you sent your uncle or sent Patrick Donnelly to Collins authorizing Donnely to offer him the sum of $400 in order to induce him to leave the jurisdiction of this Court?
A I never did sir.
Q When he came down to the Tombs and admitted to you that he had given testimony against you that was false, did you ask him to write that statement down?
A Did I ask him to write it down?
Q Yes.
A No, sir.
Q You knew he was going to be a witness against you?
A No, sir.
Q You didn't ask him to write that statement down?
A No, sir.
Q Did you ask him to go and see your lawyer?
A No, sir.
Q You felt it was for your interest to get him to make some admission that would show that the testimony that he gave before the Coroner and the Police Court was un-true?
ÿþ
437
A No, sir.
Q You knew you were going to be tried for your life?
A Yes, Billie object was in swearing that way, he knew if I didn't have the money that my people would see that he--
Q You say that his object in swearing against you was to get what money there was in it?
A Yes, sir.
Q You don't want it to be understood that the representatives of the State of New York got him to come down here for money to swear against you?
A I don't know.
Q You know it is not the fact, don't you?
A He wanted to accept it of me.
Q You know that is not the fact, that there has been no money paid him by tile representatives of the people?
A I am not saying so sir.
Q Now, did you authorize Rafferty to go to Charles Davison Friday last and any to him this: ``There is such a thing as getting mixed up on the stand when you are walled to testify. Let counsel for the defense mix you up in your examination,'' Did you authorize any
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438
such statement to be made by Rafferty to Davis?
A No, sir. I only saw the man once in the Tombs.
Q You saw Rafferty once in the Tombs?
A Yes, sir.
Q What was Rafferty doing in the Tombs?
A He made a call on me.
Q He is a friend of yours?
A Well, I am slightly acquainted with him. I knew him. I have known him the last three years.
Q How long have you known Davis?
A Davis?
Q Yes.
A About two years.
Q How long have you known Kiernan?
A Going on two years.
Q How long have you known Ruch?
A I have only known Ruch a short time.
Q Did you ever have any trouble with Ruch?
A Did I ever have any trouble with him?
Q Any difficulty with Ruch at all?
A No, sir.
Q You never had any difficulty with him?
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439
A No, sir.
Q And he never had any difficulty with you?
A No, sir.
Q Did you ever have any trouble with Kiernan?
A No, not much.
Q You never did anything to offend Kiernan?
A No.
Q And Kiernan newer did anything to offend you?
A Only sometimes when he was drunk and quarrelsome when I told him to go out and keep quiet.
Q There was never any hard feeling between you?
A No.
Q There wasn't any hard feeling between you and Collins?
A Any hard feeling?
Q Was there any hard feeling between you?
A Only that I didn't want him to serve ice.
Q You told him that you didn't want him to serve ice in your place?
A Yes, sir.
Q When were they serving ice in your place?
A I don't remember now.
Q He wasn't interested in the business?
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440
A He would supply the back bar with ice.
Q That was the only difficulty you had with Collins?
A That is the only reason that he had any revenge for me.
Q Did you ever have any trouble with O'Keefe?
A No, sir.
Q Now, you are sure of that?
A Yes. I don't think I saw him a dozen times in the place. He came to see Charlie Davis.
Q Since you have never had any difficulty of a serious character with those persosn and some of whom you have always been on friendly terms with, can you conceive of any reason that would prompt those people to come here and perjure themselves?
A They did it to get revenge.
Q To get revenge?
A Yes. They are perjuring themselves.
Q Tell me, if you can, why O'Keefe is perjuring him-self?
A I don't know sir.
Q You say you never had any difficulty with him?
A No, sir.
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Q ***Mou never did anything to him?
A No, sir.
Q And he never did anything to you?
A No, sir.
Q Can you tell me why Davis came here--
A O'Keefe told the truth.
Q O'Keefe?
A Yes, sir.
Q
A moment ago you said he was perjuring, himself?
A Well, the others were perjuring themselves. O'Keefe and Ruch told the truth. He admitted that Madden and I
had words across the bar before the shot was fired.
Q Did you hear O'Keefe say that he did not hear any difficulty or any unpleasant language used at all by and between you and Madden on that occasion?
A He a couldn't very well hear it. He said we were talking across the bar.
Q O'Keefe was standing by the storm door?
A Yes, sir.
Q And you were up at the other end of the bar?
A Yes, sir.
Q Now, you have come here and said you took Madden's
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life in self defense?
A Yes, sir.
Q You have came here and you have said that you believed at that time that your life was in danger?
A Yes, sir.
Q Now, you are willing to say that although you believed that your life was in danger and that you were forced
to take another life in self defense that the difficulty was of such a quiet and orderly character that these two people couldn't hear it?
A They heard it.
Q They say no.
A They could not distinguish what we were saying.
Q They say they heard nothing passing between you.
A Well, the time was so short they couldn't. It was all done in a minute.
Q The time was so short, How much time elapsed between the time that you first saw that man and the time you took his life?
A It was done in less than five or six minutes--it was in two minutes from the time he lit his cigar and-- MR. HOUSE: Wont you just answer the questions
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443 please.
Q You say you did it on the impulse of the moment?
A Yes, sir.
Q That is the truth, is it?
Q
A I seen when the man--
Q Go back a minute. You stated in the presence of the Court and Jury that-you did it on the impulse of the moment?
A Fearing my life was in danger.
Q Don't tell us the statutory words again. Answer the question.
BY THE COURT:
Q You said you did it on the impulse of the moment, didn't you?
A Yes, fearing--
Q Did you say so?
A No, I didn't say so.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q No? What did you say a moment ago?
A I said on the impulse of the monent as he put his hand to his pocket, on the impulse of the moment, I
grabbed the pistol back of the bar fearing that my life was in danger.
Q Go on. Use the same words again.
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444
A Fearing for my life and on the impulse of the moment I grabbed the pistol back of the bar--
Q How frequently have you repeated this testimony over that you have given on the stand to-day?
A I have only made it once to Mr. House.
Q You have committed it to memory, haven't you?
A Well, I don't know.
Q You have committed it to memory, haven't you?
A I am just telling it as it happened.
Q You say fearing that your life was in danger and you saw him out his hand beck to his hip pocket and then you took a deadly weapon and killed him?
A Yes, I dreaded my life.
Q You dreaded your life?
A Yes, of him. He had been threatening me from time to time and maybe previous for a week I was told that he was seen with a pistol--
MR. McINTYRE: Go on.
MR. HOUSE: Will you please to answer the questions and then stop. I am not going to have it. If you will be good enough to answer the questions that are put to you and permit me to argue the case as I am paid to do
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445
we will get along satisfactorily.
Q Go back to the time that Johnson was in the store on the night of the difficulty. Do you remember what day that was?
A That was the 2nd of February.
Q On the 2nd of February?
A Yes, sir.
Q And he cameinto the store with the man who had the umbrella, didn't he?
A Who was that?
Q Johnson, the colored man?
Q
A No, Johnson was in the store.
Q There was a man who came in there afterwards who had an umbrella?
A I couldn't say whether he had or not.
Q Did you hear any discussion about an umbrella?
A I did.
Q Did you hear Madden say to Johnson; ``You must have taken it?''
A I did, yes.
Q And did you hear Madden upon that occasion say to the man who was drinking with Johnson, the colored man
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446
that he had been in your store before and that he had frequently lost a silk handkerchief out of his pocket? AI didn't.
Q And then did you hear the colored man say, ``I wont let any white son of a bitch call me down?''
A No, sir.
Q You didn't hear anything of that kind?
A I was at the lower end of the bar at that time.
Q Did you hear the Negro say anything to Madden?
A Yes, sir.
Q What did you hear the negro say to Madden?
A I heard him say to Madden to mind his own business, that he wasn't interfering with him.
Q Did you hear Madden say to him, ``You must have taken the umbrella?''
A Yes, I heard some remark like that.
Q And then what did the negro do?
A The negro turned to Madden and he says, ``What is it your business? Have I done anything to you?'' And Madden says, ``Shut up, you black son of a bitch. I wont let any black son of a bitch calla white friend of mine down,'' and taking hold of a beer ***lgass he struck him on the side
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447
of the head, and then he fell.
Q Which way was the man from the bend in the bar?
A Standing at the turn of the bar.
Q How far did the negro fall?
A The negro fell way back against the lunch counter.
Q By the force of that blow that was inflicted on the side of his face the negro was thrown from the end of the bar?
A He was thrown so he couldn't strike back.
Q You saw that, did you?
A Yes, sir.
Q You saw the man cut?
A Yes, sir.
Q Why didn't you get a police officer then? Objected to as being entirely irrelevant and immaterial. Objection overruled. Exception by defendant.
A The man ran away.
Q Did you complain to any police officer on the block?
BY THE COURT:
Q Did you complain to any police officer?
A Yes, I told the officer on the beat.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q What officer?
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448
A I forget his name?
A Don't you know his name?
A No.
Q Have you made any effort to bring him here?
A No, sir.
Q You have not made any effort to find him?
A No.
Q Before the assualt upon the negro there was other trouble with Madden you stated?
A Before the assault?
Q Yes, before the assault upon the negro.
A Yes, oh, yes. Every time that he would drink we always had trouble.
Q You always had trouble?
A Yes. He would fight for nothing.
Q With whom?
A With me.
Q Did he ever strike you?
A Yes, sir.
Q Did you ever go to a police officer or to a police station to make a complaint against him.
A Yes, sir.
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449
Q Who was the officer?
A I forget the officer's name.
Q You have forgotten that too? Have you made any effort to get that officer down here?
A No.
Q What other times had he assaulted you?
A Well, whenever he was drinking.
Q Give me some specific instance.
A He insulted me every chance he had.
Q Give me some specific instance.
A I couldn't give you any special time.
Q Did he ever use a weapon on you?
A Yes.
Q When?
A He used a hook.
Q Did he stab you with it?
A No.
Q What sort of a hook?
A One of them bale hooks.
Q You didn't tell your counsel that when you were being examined in chief?
A No, I forgot that.
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450
Q Did you have that down on the statement?
A No, sir.
Q You didn't state that? Objected to.
A No, I didn't think of it.
Q You didn't try to arrest him for that?
A No.
Q Did you go to a Police Court and complain that he had tried to commit an assault upon you?
A No, sir.
Q How many times did he assault you? No answer.
BY THE COURT:
Q When was that?
A He struck me the evening that we had the trouble. That was about the 6th or 7th of April.
BY MR. McINTYRE: Q. How many times?
A Once. He struck me across the bar.
Q What did he strike you with?
A With his fist. He couldn't get nearer because of the bar.
Q You say he could not get nearer at that time because the bar was between you?
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451
A Unless he Jumped over it.
Q Now, Donnelly, when he came into the store with that hook that you speak of and struck at you, you didn't pull a pistol on him then?
A No, sir.
Q Did you fear that your life was in danger then?
A Yes.
Q You did?
A His friends that were with him took him out.
Q Did you fear your life was in danger then?
A Well, yes.
Q Did you get the pistol then?
A No.
Q Why?
A Because his friends took him away at that time before any harm was done. He was so drunk.
Q When did you have the other difficulties with him about the cuspidor--do you remember that?
A Yes, sir.
Q Was there anybody in the store when you had that trouble with him when he attempted to throw the cuspidor?
A Yes, there was two people.
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452
Q Who were they?
A I don't know.
Q Did you ever see them before?
A I saw one of them before.
Q What is his name?
A I don't know his name.
Q Have you made any effort to get him here?
A Yes, sir.
Q Have you brought him here in Court?
A No sir; I couldn't find him.
Q Haven't your friends made an effort to do so?
A I told them to try and find him.
Q Do you know the man's name?
A No, sir.
Q Do you know where he lives?
A I do not.
Q Can you give me any information about that man and I will get him?
A I can not; no sir.
Q Now, what was the trouble?
BY THE COURT:
Q Do you know that man's name?
A No sir. I had seen him before.
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453
Q How often?
A He used to stop in the store evenings about seven o'clock.
Q How often did he come there?
A Occasionally, maybe once a week.
Q And then you had seen him once a week for about how long?
A Well, I only imagine--
Q I don't want what you imagine.
A Well, it might be six weeks after I knew about his coming in there.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q What was the trouble between you and Madden when he attempted to throw the cuspdior at you?
A That was the time that I ordered him out.
Q What did he ask for?
A He wanted a drink.
Q You had an associate there, a relief man at the bar, McCabe?
A Yes, sir.
Q He used to go in there when McCabe was on duty?
A McCabe refused, too.
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454
Q McCabe never had any trouble with him?
A Yes, sir.
Q McCabe said no.
A Yes.
Q Did you hear him testify?
A Yes.
Q McCabe didn't tell the truth according to your theory?
A No.
Q McCabe has been working there for a number of years?
A All I know is because he got a sop. He is seeking revenge on me. That is all I know is his object in doing that.
Q Where were you standing when he took up this cuspidor? BY THE COURT:
Q Behind the bar?
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q What part of it?
A Near the ice box, between the ice box and the corner of the bar.
Q What did he say to you?
A What did he say to me?
Q Yes.
A He says, ``I will kill you, you son of a bitch.
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455
Q How near were you to the drawer where the pistol was?
A The pistol wasn't in the drawer.
Q If the pistol had been in the drawer, would you have used it?
A I don't know.
Q Where was the pistol on that occasion?
A It was under the counter.
Q You took it up?
A Yes, sir.
Q What did you do with it?
A I held it in my hand. I said to him, ``If you throw that cuspidor at me or, strike me, you can not get out of the door before this pistol will overtake you.''
Q You intended to shoot him?
A No sir; because, I could have shot him.
Q Did you fear that your life was in danger when he seized that iron cuspidor?
A I feared it but I was still protecting myself.
Q Now, these are two instances, once with a hook that he attempted to strike you with and the next time with an iron cuspidor that he threatened to hurl at you and then you said that he ***threanoned to kill you,
neither of which times you fired a pistol shot at him--that is so?
ÿþ
456
A No.
Q It is not so?
A Yes.
Q You didn't fire a pistol at him either time?
A Oh, no.
Q And then when he came into the bar-room on this Sunday afternoon and simply male a movement toward his hip pocket you thought then that your life was in danger and that he intended to use a deadly weapon on you?
A That was the time that he made the threats.
Q You said before that that the threats had been made?
A Not before the cuspidor time--not that he would kill me.
Q Let me get your language once more. You said that threats were communicated to you--that is your language, is it not?
A Yes, sir.
Q Didn't you consider when a remark like this is made, ``I'll kill you, you damned son of a bitch, ``didn't you consider that was a threat?
A He had used that on the sidewalk just as he did at
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457
the time of the cuspidor.
Q How long before the time that you killed him?
A It was two months.
Q Why didn't you make a complaint then that he threatened to take your life?
A I was going--
Q Why?
BY THE COURT:
Q He asked you why you didn't go and make a complaint that this man had threatened your life on several occasions?
A I was going to make a complaint and I went to his office, to Mr. Bett's office to get him to guarantee to
promise that he would see he didn't come there and he told me that he would see that he would not come back. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q Who was this Bette?
A Dr. Betts.
Qx Have you got Betts here in Court?
A No, sir.
Q When he threatened to strike you with the cuspidor afterwards did you go and make a complaint to anybody?
A No, sir.
Q Now, is there a time that you can recall to mind when
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458
these alleged assaults were made and the threats uttered that you ever made a complaint to a soul on earth?
A I told the policeman.
Q You have not got that policeman here?
A No.
Q You don't know his name?
A No.
Q You know all the policemen that patrol that block?
A No. The policeman I saw was in the 29th precinct.
Q Out of that precinct?
A He lives in the 20th precinct.
BY THE COURT:
Q Don't you know his name.
A I can't think of his name now.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q Now, Donnelly, you said that in March, that Madden had two friends with him when he entered the store and threatened to pull you from behind the bar?
A Yes, sir.
Q Who were those two persons?
A I don't know:
Q You don't?
A No, sir.
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459
Q Have you made any effort to find them?
A No they are down town where he was trucking.
Q Do you know them?
A No, I don't know them. They were trucking. They were driving Tom Betts's truck.
Q Have you made any effort to find out whose those people were?
A No, sir.
Q Did anybody ever communicate to you that he made threats against you--did anybody tell you that?
A No.
Q Nobody told you that?
A No.
Q Nobody ever told you to look out for him?
A Yes.
Q Who?
A One man--his name is Hay.
Q When did he tell you that?
A I think it was a week previous to the shooting--that same week---about three or four days previous.
Q Three or four days before the shooting?
A Yes.
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460
Q Now, did Hay frequently go into your store?
A Well, sir, not every night. He came in once or twice a week and some days he would not be in at all.
Q What did he say to you?
A He says, after they had got a drink, he says, ``I have seen that party that you had the trouble with up the street.'' I says to him, What party?'' He says, ``Madden.'' He says, ``Him and another fellow were examining a pistol as I was coming down the street.'' He says, ``You had better look out for yourself. I seen Madden put a pistol in his hip pocket.'' I says, ``I don't think he will came back to tackle me any more.''
Q You heard him say that he saw Madden examining a pistol?
A Yes, sir.
Q And you were told that he had a pistol?
A Yes, sir.
Q And that he put the pistol in his pocket?
A Yes, sir.
hear
Q Did you Hay say this morning that he saw Madden down the street with a pop-gun?
A Yes, sir.
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461
Q Which was it, a pistol or a pop-gun?
A I presume it was a pop-gun. I call it a pistol.
Q I asked you for Hay's language?
A I misunderstood you.
Q Now you want to change it?
A No, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q What did Hay say when he came in that evening and had his drink, as you say? Go on and tell the Jury.
A He says, ``I seen that fellow that you had the trouble with up the street.''
Q Go on.
A ``And him and another fellow was standing in front of a stable as I was coming down the street and I saw the other fellow that was with him hand him the pistol and Madden put the pistol in his pocket.'' And he says to
me, ``You had better look out for yourself.'' I says, ``I don't think he will come back,'' I says, ``to tackle me again.''
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q Now, you remember being examined by Captain Price in the station house, don't you?
A Yes, sir.
ÿþ
462
Q You remember making a statement to him?
A I made a kind of statement to him.
Q Did you make a statement to him?
A Yes, sir.
Q Did you sign it?
A Yes, sir.
Q Just look at that and see if that is in your hand--writing? (Paper shown witness.)
A Yes, that is my handwriting.
Q Do you remember stating this to Captain Price?
MR. HOUSE: One moment, if your Honor please. I want to know whether the District Attorney proposes to read from that statement.
THE COURT: He has a right to call-his attention to it.
MR. HOUSE: May I have-the privilege of getting an objection on the record? THE COURT: Certainly.
MR. HOUSE: I object to the District Attorney calling the defendant's attention to any statement that was made to Captain Price on the ground that at the time the defendant was under arrest and, consequently, in duress
ÿþ
463
and no statement made at that time would be binding against him.
THE COURT: That want do. Any statement that he makes freely and voluntarily is admissible. It doesn't make any difference whether it is under duress or not. (To Mr. McIntyre. You had better ask him whether he made the statement.
Q Do you remember saying this to Captain Price upon his examination of you?
Bt THE COURT:
Q When you were arrested and brought to the station house was Captain Price there?
A Was Captain Price there?
Q When was it you made that statement?
A After I went to the station house.
Q Immediately upon entering?
A Five or ten minutes after.
Q Did you make that statement to Captain Price?
A I made a statement--
Q Can't you answer?
A Yes, sir.
Q Was that statement reduced to writing?
A I presume it was.
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464
Q Did you see him write it?
A I saw him write it.
Q Did he read over the statement to you after he had taken it?
A Yes, sir.
Q You signed it?
A Yes, I signed it.
Q Did Captain Price make any threat against you?
A No, sir.
Q Did he make any promise to you in consideration of your making that statement?
A No, sir.
Q Did you make that statement freely and voluntarily?
A Well, he asked me--
Q Did you make that statement freely and voluntarily?
A Well, as near as I knew then.
Q As near as you knew then? What ever statement you made you made it of your own free will?
A Yes, sir.
THE COURT: Go on.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q Did you say to Captain Price ``Charles Madden came into the store and went into the
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465
water-closet. I was not in the store when he entered. He came out of the water-closet and approached the bar. There were three other persons in the store at the time, namely, George F. Ruch, Daniel O'Keefe and Pat Callahan. Did you say that?
A I did not make that statement.
Q Look at the paper.
A That is all right. I admit that being in the paper but I did not say that he went into the closet. I said I
didn't know. He came from the rear end of the store.
Q When Captain Price took your statement down in writing did he read it over to you--you swore to this statement, didn't you?
A Yes, I did. I was sitting there when it was wrote.
MR. HOUSE: He doesn't subscribe himself as an Notary.
THE COURT:
A police captain has no authority to swear a man that I am aware of.
Q You say you admit the rest of it?
A Not that he went into the closet.
Q Did you state this: ``And the other bartender was in the water-closet at the time the shooting occurred.
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466
Madden asked me to give him a drink. I refused and ordered him out of the store. He called me a sun of a bitch and put his hand in his right pants pocket and said I will fix you?'' Did you say that?
A Yes, sir.
Q You said that?
A Yes, sir.
Q You remember saying that?
A Yes, I think that was it.
Q Do you remember stating this: ``As he did that, I opened the drawer and pulled out the revolver and fired at him?
A I didn't make that statement.
BY THE COURT:
Q How much of that statement did you make?
A I said the drawer was open.
Q In other respects that is right?
A Yes, sir.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q You said the drawer was open and this statement says you opened it. That, you say, is incorrect?
A That is not correct.
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467
Q ``He was standing close to the bar facing me. The pistol was in the drawer behind me. I was standing facing him. I turned around, got the pistol and shot him.'' Did you say that?
A I did not make that statement.
BY THE COURT:
Q How much of that statement did you make?
A The statement that I made was that he went to pull a gun on me and on the impulse of the moment I grabbed the pistol back of the bar and fired without any aim.
BY MR McINTYRE:
Q The statement that you made was that he put his hand on his pocket and on the impulse of the moment you turned and got a pistol and fired?
A I didn't have to turn, no sir.
Q He said, I'll fix you and I opened the drawer and pulled out the revolver and fired at him.'' Did you say that?
A I was standing close to the--
Q ``The pistol was in the drawer behind me. I was standing facing him. I turned around and got the pistol and shot him.'' Did you say that?
A No, I didn't make that statement.
ÿþ
468
Q You didn't make that statement?
A No, sir.
Q ``He never said a word.'' Did you say that?
A I didn't.
Q You didn't say that either?
A No.
Q ``He turned around and walked out into the street.'' Did you say that?
A I said he walked out into the street.
Q ``He never said a word but turned around--
A I did not say that.
Q Do you say this is all wrong? You signed it?
THE COURT: You have asked him if he signed it now, go on.
Q Did you say this: ``I knew Madden for two years past. When he works, he is a truck driver for Dr. Betts of West 28th Street. I have had trouble with him about six or eight weeks ago owing to some trouble he had with a negro in which case Madden cut the negro, the assault having been committed in the store where the shooting took place.'' Did you say that?
A Yes. Not all of it. I admit some of it.
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BY THE COURT:
Q What part do you admit?
A I admit that I told him about the trouble with the colored fellow. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q But you don't remember anything else?
A No.
Q When the Captain was interrogating you as to your reason for shooting the deceased, why did't you tell him that at one time he used a hook and another time he attempted to, throw a cus***pidor and at another time a man came into the store and told you that Madden was down in the street with a pistol?
A That didn't come into my head.
Q You didn't think of it?
A I didn't tell my own counsel.
Q Did you say this to Captain Price: ``Madden was not drunk when I shot him?''
A He was not very drunk.
BY THE COURT:
Q did you say that to Captain Price?
A He asked me if he was drunk. I said he was not drunk but he had been drinking. He was able to walk. BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q ``Shortly afterwards Officer O'Neill
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entered and asked who done the shooting. I answered I did.'' Did you say that?
A No.
Q You didn't say that either?
A I said it in a different way.
Q What did you say?
A I said the shooting was done by me in self defense.
Q The response was as Captain Price has recorded it that you said that you did the shooting?
A That is not the way I said it.
Q Did you say ``I was then placed under arrest and taken before Madden who was lying on the sidewalk in West
28th Street who identified me as the man who shot him. He then asked for the pistol and I told him that it was in the drawer where I placed it after the shooting. Did you say that?
A I said part of that.
Q ``I returned to the store and took it from the drawer and gave it to the officer.
A I gave it to the officer.
Q That part of it is correct?
A That is right.
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Q Did Madden ever attempt to assault you with anything else but the two things you have mentioned, namely a cuspidon and a hook?
A Not as I remember.
Q You don't remember?
A No.
Q Sure?
A Sure.
Q Just take your memory back as best you can and see whether he ever attempted to assault you with anything else?
A Not outside of his fist.
Q Did you ever say he attempted to assault you with a glass?
A Did I?
Q Yes.
A That was long ahead of that.
Q I ask you whether you ever said that?
Q Who did you say that to?
A Perhaps it is on that statement.
Q I am asking if you ever said it to anybody?
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A I don't know unless I made it in the statement to the Captain.
Q You said that he attempted to assault you with a glass?
A Yes, sir.
Q Now, when he was leaning against the bar--I am speaking of that Sunday afternoon when you shot him--was he talking in a loud tone of voice?
A Not loud, just the same as we are talking.
Q Talking as loud as I am? Then the others could have heard him over that bar?
A I presume they could have if they were paying attention.
Q There was nothing boisterous, his tone was not angry?
A Oh, yes.
Q Boisterous?
A Yes, sir.
Q Enough to atract the attention of the other people?
A He was--
Q Was it loud enough to atract the attention of the people in the store.
A There was only Collins. He was bank in the corner.
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Q Collins was standing at the end of the bar?
A About eight feet back.
Q How high is this bar from the floor?
A I presume it is higher than that. (Referring to the bench.)
Q Was he leaning with his left side to the bar?
A No, sir.
Q Which side?
A He was standing in this form, (Indicating.) to the bar with the cigar in his mouth. He was standing there
and I was down this way and he made a move with his hand-when he seen he couldn't gat any drink--when I said I
didn't want any more trouble--then he says, ``I'll fix you.''
Q Was his right arm hanging down?
A His right arm was back.
Q Where was it?
A Down somewhat.
Q Hanging down?
A Yes.
Q And he said, ``I will fix you'' then? Q
A Yes, His arm was in front of him.
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Q When he said ``I will fix you'' then you turned around and took the revolver out of the drawer?
A On the impulse of the moment.
BY THE COURT:
Q Did you turn around?
A I didn't turn around.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q How did you get the revolver?
A I reached for the revolver.
Q How did you know where to get the revolver?
A I knew where it was. It was in the drawer.
Q Did you see it there that morning?
A No, I didn't notice it that morning.
Q Did you know the revolver was there?
A I wasn't sure. I didn't look.
Q Is it not a fact that you turned full around?
A I didn't turn at all. The pistol was on my side in the back part of the drawer and I turned to reach for that pistol. The drawer was half open and I took it out with my right hand.
Q What did you do, with it?
A Without taking any aim I snapped the trigger.
Q Did you wait to see whether Madden drew a revolver from his pocket?
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A Did I wait?
Q Did you wait to see?
A No, sir; I didn't wait. On the impulse of the moment-
Q When Madden said, ``I will fix you,'' and then when you saw his hand going back to his hip pocket you put your hand in the drawer and took out the revolver and fired?
A On the impulse of the moment without taking any aim.
Q Now, as soon as was shot, he went away?
A He turned and he held his arm in this form and he says, ``I am shot,'' and he turned from the bar and walked deliberately over to the door.
Q He walked deliberately out?
A Yes, sir.
Q That was very ***aatural for him to do?
A He turned at the storm door and walked as far as half way between the storm door and the Eighth Avenue. BY THE COURT:
Q Did you see him?
A No. That was where he was when I came out. He was lying oh the cellar door.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q When he started to go away did he put his hand down to his hip pocket again?
A No, sir.
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Q He didn't take out any revolver?
A I didn't see it.
Q He didn't take out any?
A I didn't see any.
Q Did he?
A No, he threw up his hand.
Q You had shot him but he was able to walk out to the side door?
A Yes, sir.
Q He did walk to the side door and did not take any revolver out of his pocket to return the fire that you had opened on him?
A No.
Q You then put the revolver back in the drawer?
A No, sir.
Q What did you do?
A I held the pistol in my hand.
Q Covered him with it?
A No, I had it in my hand.
Q What for?
A I was afraid in case he would turn and pull a pistol on me.
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Q You didn't see any pistol in his hand?
A No, he didn't make any attempt, a second attempt to put his hand in his hip pocket.
Q You don't know whether he had any pistol or not?
A I can't swear to it.
Q You kept him under the cover of the point of this revolver until he went out?
A I held in my hand.
Q You held it to shoot?
A I held it in my hand.
Q Did you go afterwards to see what had happened?
A I did not.
Q You stayed right in the barroom?
A Yes, sir.
Q What for?
A There was no one in the bar at the time only those three men.
Q Where was the other bar-keeper?
A The other bar-keeper was in the closet.
Q Did you say to those men who were in the store after you fired the pistol shot, ``I thought he was going to pull a revolver on me and I shot him in self defense?''
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A I don't remember whether I said that?
Q Did you say anything about self defense when you were behind the bar in the presence of those people in the store?
A I might have made use--
BY THE COURT:
Q Did you say it?
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q Did you say to McCabe when he came out of the water-closet that you had just shot Madders?
A I did not.
Q You didn't say anything?
A I said, ``I will have to be taken to the station house.''
Q You say you fired that shot because you thought your life was in danger--
A I dreaded of my life from the man that came into the store following me for that purpose. BY THE COURT:
Q Did you see him do that?
A I did not; no sir.
BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q You did not go to see how badly you had hurt him?
A No, sir.
Q You did not know when you had shot him?
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A No.
Q You did not care?
A I was sorry that it $$ that it turned out that it was the cause of his death.
Q You didn't go to do anything for him?
A I was willing to.
Q You did not?
A No, I did not.
Q You stayed right behind the bar?
A I had no chance to get out.
Q Why?
A There wasn't any one in the saloon.
Q And a human life was nothing compared with the loss of business for a few moments? THE COURT: There isn't any use in your going into an argument.
Q McCabe was there?
A He was in the closet.
Q He came then out of the closet?
BY THE ``COURT:
Q Did you go out for an officer--to find him?
A No sir; I couldn't do it as I had no time.
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BY MR. McINTYRE:
Q Now, You said that you did not contemplate shooting this man in your examination-in-chief?
A What?
Q You stated to Mr. House that you did not contemplate shooting this man.
A No, I didn't mean to kill the man.
BY THE COURT:
Q Did you mean to strike him.
Q No, I didn't mean to. I didn't mean to hit him.
BY MR. McINTYRE: What did you fire the pistol for?
A It went off on the impulse of the moment. I snapped the trigger quicker than I expected when I was threatened.
THE FOREMAN: Can I ask the ***winness what was the time when the pistol was loaded and who loaded it? THE COURT: Yes, sir.
BY THE COURT:
Q You said, as I understood you, that the pistol was in the store when you went there to work?
A Yes, Sir.
Q And you were there ***aboug eighteen months?
A Yes, sir.
Q Where was it kept during the eighteen months?
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A It generally lay under the bar.
Q When it didn't lay under the bar where was it kept?
A It was put in the drawer.
Q Do you know who loaded that pistol?
A I do not know.
Q Did you know whether it was loaded at the time that you took it up?
A The first time? Yes, I think it was.
Q You did know it?
A Yes, I did.
Q The first time?
A I think it was, I am not sure. I did not examine it.
Q Did you ever examine it?
A No sir, I never examined it.
Q You say that you put your finger upon the trigger of that pistol without knowing it was loaded?
A No.
Q Didn't you know it was loaded?
A Well I didn't--
Q You did not?
A I didn't examine it the first time.
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Q Did you ever know that that pistol was loaded during the eighteen months?
A Well, I didn't examine it.
A I didn't ask you that. Didn't you know it at any time?
A I didn't.
Q That is what this gentleman wants to know.
A I knew there was some--I didn't know they were all.
Q You knew there was some?
A I, didn't examine all the cartridges.
Q You examined same?
A Yes, sir.
Q You recollected there were some?
A Yes, sir.
Q Is that what you wish to say?
A Yes.
BY MR. HOUSE:
Q Now, Mr. Donnelly, you have been asked by the District Attorney why it was that after you fired the shot and Madden went out that you didn't go to see whether a human life had been taken or not. Now, is it not true, as a matter of fact, that as Madden disappeared through that door that Officer O'Neill
appeared in
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the saloon?
A That is right.
Q Right there?
A Yes, sir.
THE COURT: Are there any Jurors who would like to ask this man any questions? (No response.) Defendant rests.
THE COURT: I will let this case stand over until to-morrow. You will finish this case to-morrow? MR. HOUSE: Yes, sir.
THE COURT: (To the Jury.) Gentlemen the defendant has closed his case and the District Attorney informs me that he has three or four witnesses to call in rebuttal. We will resume here to-morrow morning and work until night if necessary to finish this case. In the meantime, you will not talk about the case and you will observe
the statutory admonition heretofore given you. Adjourned to 11 A. M. FRIDAY, MARCH 2, 1894.